My entire goal of everything I was doing was just out. Can I become unbreakable if you want to be unbreakable, you have to put yourself in situations where a lot of people would give up or break. I reached 100 million dollar net worth by the age of 29. Ultimately the hormones you had become the ultimate power couple together. They made over a hundred million dollars by their early 30s. And today you get arrested six times. Then at 19 years old, you say like, all right, that's it. You start listening to Tony Robbins, Jim Rohn. Five years later, you're running an incredible business worth.
As of dollars. What were the things that you did? When it was most difficult? I was like I am not this Layla who I was yesterday. Who just did all this bullshit? I can just choose to be completely different today when you change your environment that new environment, no longer accepts the version of yourself that you were. It only accepts you stepping into a better person we've talked before about the situation where you and Alex were going to get married is one of the hardest conversations. I've had in my whole life, I don't think there's any way around it. How has becoming more well known publicly changed the relationship at all.
I mean, I'll be honest, I actually think that it might have made it even
Leila, welcome to the podcast. It's not every day that I speak to somebody who has the same birthday as me. So, welcome, July 13th. Is a special day. Oh, that's so cool. What year? 1995. Oh, I'm old. I'm starting to feel old. Okay. But looking yeah, looking young as ever and I would love to start with you at 22 years old, living in a cabin, in the woods with no cell service minimal Wi-Fi. What?
Was that experience like and what did you learn about yourself?
It was.
Intense, I would say I think that it was some of the hardest months of my life just because it was very isolating, you know, I didn't have friends, I didn't have family and I didn't feel much of a sense of community with any of the people that I worked with at that time the actual place where I was working, it is like crazy, high standards for everyone working there, so it's very stressful job and its own. So to be interning there, they held you to very high standards.
So I think most of the time that I was there, I just remember an overwhelming sense of loneliness.
I did a lot of reading and I did a lot of hiking and working out and I think, in the end of the day, it was a lot of self-reflection. But the feeling that I associate with that time, it's just feeling alone. It's not like scared or
Worried but just really just wanting somebody to talk to even because I was so busy at that point in time to that, like, when I got done every day it was like 8:00 p.m. PST and my actually any of my friends were on East Coast. So it was like even if I had time and I was not dead tired. I didn't really have anyone to talk to. So that was how it felt in terms of what I learned about myself. I think it was great.
In terms of it tested my capacity and not just honestly it was physically but also mentally I think that getting up every day at 3:30 or 4:00 a.m., you know leading a hike going back, you know, teaching classes, running errands doing whatever. Honestly I just did whatever they needed me to do for all these people and then teaching more exercise classes, then leading a hike again at 5 p.m. then going to a dinner and entertaining guests and then coming back.
8:00 p.m. and walking alone in the woods, back home, with a flashlight, it just taught me what I'm capable of doing. And I think that before that point in time, I had had multiple jobs, and I've been in college and I, you know, worked, but I think nothing was that. Strenuous in terms of hours, worked per day, physical like exertion per day. And at the same time feeling incredibly stressed, obviously, I wanted to perform because
You have to, they grade you. And that's how you basically passed the internship to graduate college. And so wanting to feel like I was doing a good job. But at the same time, I was consistently fighting just absolute exhaustion. Like to the point where I remember teaching the class, and we did Tabata right was like 10 seconds on 20 seconds off, or yeah. And when they were off, I remember, I was like, all right, now you go do push-ups for 20 seconds and I looked forward to the push-ups because I could close my eyes while they were on the ground.
Round
doing the push-ups and I was like, oh my God, this feels amazing. I've never felt that
tired in my life or lonely. And I think the reason that it was, I think a lot of instances in life when we feel that way, it's almost people feel like it's unbearable to feel that lonely or feel at tired because there's no end in sight. And so I actually think what was really useful was the fact that I knew that that was only going to last six months. No matter what.
Hmm. So you had the, the
Point. And that was helpful.
Yeah, I think that was a good anchor for me because I was like I can do this for this much more time and I'm sure I would have found a different way to rationalize. If I didn't know what I was going to end, but it was helpful to know, like I'm going to eventually see people. Again, this is temporary. I can do this for six months. Like it's worth it to do it now and I think
I was so focused on becoming a better person at that point in my life. Like my entire goal of everything I was doing was just like how can I become unbreakable? Wow. And I think that was what I wanted for myself and so I felt like if you want to be unbreakable, you have to put yourself in situations where a lot of people would give up or break or whatever meltdown. So I think I was I'd primed myself for it. So it wasn't as
Hard as it would have been for some others. If that makes sense
becoming unbreakable is kind of a goal that not many 22 year olds have. So like what led that to be the goal?
I think from a young age just like being in a house when I grew up where I watched my mother, when my parents got divorced, go from this, like strong woman, who was like a great mother to me.
To just allowing the circumstances to just continuously break her down mentally physically, you know, went into drugs and alcohol. And I just remember thinking as a kid and I I took this day don't know why when I was so young, I had these thoughts but I was like I just never want that to be me. Like I never want to be that person where she was, so she ended up being so dependent on. Even just having like a boyfriend that I remember the day. She
Doubt of one of her boyfriends house has. She had to get the new one to move her into his house because she couldn't even be alone. And I honestly, I was disgusted by it. Like I did tested. That, that was how she was. I was
Sad. That, that was my mother. Who had been this like very strong person and I think a lot of my life from that point on after I left her house and I decided that it wasn't good for me to keep her.
There was more cost and benefit to having her in my life. I had that in my mind, it was just like, that was what I was really focused on was like, how do I be so opposite of this? Because I feel like it was definitely fueled by fear. Like I was like I never want to end up like her even like times are like plants myself in the mirror look and be like I thought I even looked like her and in a moment it was just like terrifying to me. So I think I was just so scared of being anything like her.
but I realized, I think I realized as I've gotten older that I do have a lot of
Habits inclinations personality traits that she had, I've just chosen to use them to better my life and she allowed them to make her life worse.
And so I think when I was so when I moved out of her house, I was almost 15 and I moved in with my dad and she had tried to kill herself. And that was why I moved out as basically like there's no choice at this point. That was when I think I was very angry and all I wanted to focus on like I joined a gym. I wanted to start learning bodybuilding and start learning how to lift weights, you know, I stopped.
I say, like, I started focusing much more on school because I was, like, I really want to make sure like I mentally, I'm sharp. I started listening to Tony Robbins and Jim Rohn and like all the people back then that had like two self-development tapes. And I think it was just out of, like, God, I just, I never want that to be my life, you know, and I think it was terrifying to me that I was related to somebody who would allow that to happen to themselves.
And that lasted me until I was like,
25 like just everything I did was to not be like her.
So you get arrested six times in the span from when you're fifteen to your 19 is that correct?
Had arrested six times between 18 and
19. Wow, so on the first arrest you weren't saying to yourself. Wow, I'm acting like my mom or you were on the second. The third, the fourth, the fifth well at least it was until the 6 where it took you to change your behavior and look at yourself in the mirror as that person.
Right? Because before you had been doing the same actions, but it was resulting in. You doing getting arrested again and again? So why is that the case why on the six-time and what happened? On the first five times? I've never really heard you go too deep into
that. Yeah, yeah. I think a lot of people, like, when you get arrested for, I'm like being drunk, she's like, like being drunk getting caught with liquor, like, honestly, I don't even remember whatever exact time was, I'm pretty sure it was like five a my peas and some
Else. And, you know, the first few times, I think it was hard for me to feel like I was going in that direction because
It was just being a fuck off in college, you know what I mean? Like I truly just didn't think about long-term consequences that that point time. And I feel like actually what it was is that I had been so hard on myself for so many years and ever since I moved in with my dad for that next four years, it was like I held myself to such a high standard like I actually I worked out every day. I did all these things, I hung out with good people like I got good grades but it felt like there was this like
I hadn't built a lot of rules for myself about what I am not allowed to do because I didn't want to be like her
like what
you can't drink to the point where you get drunk like that. An example like you don't go out and party like this. And I think I built a lot of those rules thinking like that would
Mentally I'm like, I don't do those things. I won't be like her and then the moment that I got out of my parents house and I had my own money and had my own place to live and all these things. I was like, I just remember the sense of Freedom feeling so great and feeling, like gosh, I'm so sick of all of this. These rigid rules that I've made for myself and I kind of rebounded in the other direction. So, it was like four years. I went so far in One Direction that it feels like it almost like, catapulted me into the other.
Action where I felt like God. I'm so sick of like my whole life feeling like I've just cared so much I've tried so hard like from a young age because when she was you know, when she was in the house and I was nine years old and I'm taking care of her and I'm taking care of the house and I'm making sure that we have food. And I'm going to my friends house that I learned how to take care of myself. But I felt like I was young and didn't know how to handle all that. And so I feel like this ressentiment almost built up anger of just feeling
honestly, like, I felt like it wasn't fair, right? Like I felt like things weren't fair and I think that I hadn't thought that through. And so, when I got to that age and all of a sudden, I was in this environment where I could not do all of those things and also not get really punished for it because it's normal in college, then I felt like, it's okay, it's normal. I also was around a lot of people who that was not a normal like it was like not a weird thing to like be getting super drunk blacked out doing drugs. And so I think
It's who I surrounded with myself with, if the environment that changed and that coupled with this just anger that had not gone away.
So then at 19 years old, you say, like, all right, that's it, six time. And you start listening to Tony Robbins, Jim Rohn. And you know, it's pretty crazy because five years later, you're running an incredible business worth millions of dollars have millions in your bank account that's five years of time. What I'm curious about is to explore like that first year in more depth. What were the things that you did when it was
Most difficult because I feel like that's often the the place where a lot of people get stuck for many years.
Yeah, I
made a decision in that moment that it wasn't like what are the things that I'm going to do to change right now? I was like, I am no longer this person done and it was like, I'm not saying, this is what other people should do. I'm just sharing what I did. I was like I am not this Layla who I was yesterday. Who just got arrested? Who just did all this bullshit? No longer me anymore. I am a new person, I am. Now, this person who's on this,
And I remember thinking that I was, like, I can just choose to be completely different today as awful as it may feel. And I remember thinking to myself, I was like, I feel so awful right now. I don't think I could feel worse and so I can either feel awful and be the same or I can feel awful and be better. And at least start to make myself proud of who I am.
And I think that that was the primary thought that I had in my head is like, it feels awful either way. Only one way is going to get me to a life that I know will actually be one. All enjoy later on and I think I'd been sacrificing so much of my future for the things I wanted to do in the moment and the, you know, urges compulsions whatever you want to say, drinking going out doing drugs like just indulging in all of that.
And it was just like a switch and I just chose to turn it on and I think there's a lot of suspect like Superstition around, change that tells us that it takes a certain amount of time that we need to be able to do a certain amount of things. And I have just found over and over in my life, that that's an illusion. And that's just
What works for plenty of people. But I also know that I have a gear that I can kind of put it into where I can just flip a switch and that was what I did. And then it was like, literally the next day I joined a gym. I threw out all my crappy food. I looked for a lease to go move out, so I could live on my own and I went on, like all my social media, I took out everybody who I didn't want to be friends with anymore. I unfriended everything. I think I made a new profile and I was like this is no longer my life. I'm not doing it.
and I think a lot of it was honestly just driven by
a new sense of like I thought to myself,
If I keep doing this, what does my life look like, in five years and the thought of, if I continue to gain weight, if I continue to get arrested, if I continue to hang out with these people and do drugs, what is likely to happen? And I remember like thinking that for such a period of time for last, like two years, I felt like I was almost Invincible to like the laws of nature and in that moment realizing I'm not
And I think that that was what was a big wake-up call is realizing like at what point is enough enough?
You know, and at that point I was like, I'm going to make it today because I don't want to see what this could turn into. And so I think the biggest thing that I did in that moment, if you think like mechanically what did I do, is I change my environment very quickly. You know, I went and I got a new apartment and I lived by myself. I didn't live with six people who partied and smoked weed and did drugs all the time. You know, I surrounded my in terms of like the content I was consuming. I started consuming things again that were
A productive and aligned with what I wanted to be rather than keeping me stuff where I was, I threw out literally all the food I even though I like, you know, it's like you're in college working jobs. Like you do a lot of money, I'm like, I don't care. I'm throwing it all out. I'm getting like egg whites, yogurt, and soy milk. Like, it was like, you know, and tuna no, tuna packets were like, what I live off of and I think it was just taking that Massive Action to create a different environment. I think that in the end that was the best thing that I did for myself because
When you change your environment that new environment, no longer accepts the version of yourself that you were. It only accepts you stepping into a better version and I think that I believe in autonomy and free will to a degree but I think outside circumstances have so much more power over us than we think. And if you go into a circumstance let's look at like a relationship, right? There's a girl. Every time she wants attention from her boyfriend. She wins
Cries. And then he gets her attention. And that's because he he finds that acceptable. He tolerates that kind of behavior. She goes and gets into a relationship with the new guy. She cries and whines and he's like, bitch I'm out, did she keep crying and whining if she wants the boyfriend more than she wants to cry and whine, she will learn to not cry and whine anymore. And so the same goes for situations of like where you're living. It's like if I surround myself with new friends who find it gross to like go,
Go out and get blacked out and do all those things, then the likelihood that I go out and get blacked out and do all that is low because I don't want to lose all my friends.
Yeah, that's a really good explanation. And, you know, in that time I, you said, you said, you were listening to Tony Robbins a lot. And then I know in the last year, or two, you've spent time with Tony Robbins to learn from him. One-on-one, was that a surreal experience? What do you learn and did you just like pinch yourself? Like, oh well, I was at this point.
This was the guy that was helping me in some sense and now I'm meeting him face-to-face and learning from him directly like was that a big moment of oh wow. I've come a long way or did that even cross your radar?
It's interesting. It's like, I don't think I've ever felt to myself like oh you've come a long way but I can look back and think, like, wow I'm very different now, like it's more than it doesn't even feel like that was me. So when I talk about it, it doesn't feel like that was even my life because it feels like it was so long ago and it's so
I don't ever think about it, like, outside of this podcast and podcast when people ask not a thought crosses into my head about it, because I think I made the decision to change and I was like, I'm Not Looking Back, I just didn't find it to be useful. So I think meeting him
What I
have actually learned in meeting so many of the people that I looked up to, which I think is the most valuable lesson is that they're all human too, you know, and I think that's actually what's my favorite thing about meeting what you could call a hero's. And what I hope people feel if when they meet me, if they consider me even close to. That is like they are all human. They are flawed. They are human. Like people just like everybody else and I think when you spend more time with somebody you start to see that in them.
But when they're very far away it seems it almost does the audience a disservice because they seem Godlike and then you think, well, I'm not God like so I can't do what they do. But I think that what it actually taught me real real is that I want to be more relatable for people because I don't want anyone to ever see what I do and think they can't do it because I'm like this unattainable, you know, Marvel character that they could never be because that's just not the case.
so, I think that's actually the biggest takeaway that I've had from learning him meeting him and meeting other people that I've looked up to is just like I want for myself to be able to
Be transparent enough about the struggles and the imperfections. So that people never feel like they can't achieve what I have achieved.
Yeah, that's an amazing take away and you've said before that your vibe off camera was different than your Vibe on camera sometimes. Yeah, how do you, how do you stand on that today? In terms of you are on camera person Persona versus who you are off camera?
I think it's much better. Like I definitely think it's better.
It's improving. I think it's just in my like if you break it down to science, I think it's, I need more and more exposure to cameras. And so the more that cameras are around me, the more that I am at ease, the less anxious, I am therefore better content and I think it just takes time. So I think I'm a lot closer.
I just don't, I don't consider it there yet until like, it's
It'll probably take another couple of years. I would say, well, maybe not, you can take like a year. Yeah.
What are some things you could do to make it more real? That are uncomfortable that you wouldn't want to do.
I mean, Jason's here, filming me all day today so you know and like it's during right where the book launch. We're about to launch the book and I'm like stressed out of my mind. There's all this like last-minute shit going on. So like why would I want to be on camera? No, I don't want to be on camera. I think it.
Doing things that when you don't want to do them to get used to it.
You know, like if every time I want to be on camera as the only time I film then like I'm not going to get any better at it, right? Because you can't do everything when you feel your best, you have to do things when you don't feel your best. And then you learn that, you can still show up. So I think it's just doing more of that kind of stuff, you know? Even just us doing this podcast. I told my team, I was like, I'm gonna do one podcast a week for the next, however, long. So I think we just lined it up throughout like December, because I've just not taking them, you know what I mean? I'm just like, I'm busy and then, you know,
This is like a slight bit of like a like to a podcast. What it's like, there's something going on that happens during the podcast. What if something needs to move back to move them? Like it's excuses.
Yeah, well a lot of people are very happy that you just said that and they're going to be reaching out to you. I'm very sure to have you on their podcast. You've said before that aligning your thoughts words and actions is really important to you. And I think it should be important to every human being who ever lives but we don't always do that one. Why don't our thoughts words and actions? Align oh is and to how do we get better at that
scale?
I can't speak for other people but for me just has to do with judgment. You know, I think there's two levels which is
I might think something and I don't want to say it because I'm fearful of what other people will think, right. And I'm afraid of them judging me and at the same time, I think it's
Sometimes we judge ourselves for the things that we say, even. So I think there's two levels that you have to kind of think through and I mean judge as in, I think what would more closely articulate what I'm trying to say is shame, which is we don't want to say the things that we think, because we're ashamed that we even think it. And for me, I've just personally found that every time I'm able to share something, say something talk about something that I'm worried. What people
Going to say or think and I'm also kind of ashamed to talk about, like even like getting arrested six times, I didn't share that much until a few months ago because I'm not proud of it, you know what I mean? But I think that what I've realized is that that has been where I've been able to find my confidence in showing up for people, both on social media and within my company. I feel so much more at ease than I ever have because I don't hide anything and it's not like I think we don't.
Intentionally hide things, but we can just leave things out, right? And instead, I think I've looked at more opportunities like, where can I share this? Because if I share these things, they no longer has power over me.
And I think that a lot of the times, the reason people can't align what they think with what they say with, what they do is because they're so terrified of maybe the things they did and having to share what those things were and how are people going to react and on the other side, they're afraid of sharing the things they think. Because what if people think that they're I don't know ridiculous or stupid or whatever. And I think if you can on the other end of it, if you do something and you are afraid to share what you did, you should absolutely own what you did.
Because you take away, anybody else's power to control that narrative, you know, like when I got my nose and brows done, I knew before I went in six months up to it. I had so much anxiety because I was like, crap. I'm like on camera now. Like this isn't like when I got my boobs done, when I was 20 and nobody barely knew besides like the guy at the gym, that's like we all know girl. You know now it's like thousands and hundreds of thousands of people being like, holy, F, your face. And I was like, oh my gosh what do I do?
I do, and it was like the moment I asked myself that I was like, oh, I'm gonna absolutely own this 100% because I know plenty of people who get that kind of stuff done, and then they just like, you know, slowly link it. And then people like, you know, you say anything about the, you know, like, back they can face is completely different. And people are like, this is a little awkward for us, but it's okay, maybe she doesn't talk about it and I'm just like, dude, I just never, I just never want to be that person, like I just don't, that looks awful. Having to lead a life where like you're ashamed of your actions.
And I think that the shame comes from not talking about the actions, I don't even think that anything inherently is shameful or not shameful, I think it's that we have this preconceived notion that it is or isn't and then we hide it and then that compounds the shame and we feel worse and worse. So I think from an action standpoint, I look at it. Like I gained my power back by talking about the things that I have done or haven't done and then from a thought to speaking, if you're thinking about that way of like I'm thinking
Thing. And I'm going to say it, I think that one is just the fear of judgment, you know, I think if we use the same situation, people are like, what are you going to say? When, you know, my friends? Like what are you going to say? When you share, like what you did with your are you going to tell them that, you know, like you were insecure? And like it was a, I was like, no, man tell him the truth which is like, I have money and I found a good doctor and I think I would look way better with a different nose and you know what? If they want to say that that is conceited or it sounds terrible to say,
Out loud or anything, that's fine, but I'm not going to lie and say I was some insecure little girl who's scared about her nose. Like, I've never felt that way. You know, I just was like if I can make something look better in the money, doesn't matter to me, then, I'm gonna do it, you know, I just, and so, I think from both of those directions, that is where I found so much.
I guess you could say confidence. It's like I just don't feel like I have anything to hide. And I wish that for everybody because I think that most people go around, especially nowadays, with social media, walking around with something to hide. And I feel like we just need more people to actually speak freely and think
freely.
Yeah, and that comes from having peace of knowing that you've put everything out there that needs to be out there. You know, you've you've talked before about the situation where you and Alex were going to get married. And before you did, you're sitting on a couch going through everything that are the things between you guys, and that that was. And that's a good example of like, all right, I feel shame to have this.
And now I'm going to say it and that's really uncomfortable and that's the reason why people don't what was that conversation? Like because I think people can benefit from learning about how you guys approach that situation
is one of the hardest conversations I've had in my whole life.
Like I don't think there's any way around it. I remember we were both so uncomfortable because I don't think either of us at that point in time we're nearly as skilled and communication as we are now. But I think that we knew we just have to be able to tell each other. Everything that we think everything we were feeling as uncomfortable as it may be. Otherwise there's no way this marriage will work in the long term.
They're just not. And so, you know, that's a lot of shit. Especially when we had only met a year prior, I think we both had a lot that had happened prior to that. And then that year was really tough and stressful, you know? And so to say everything that we feel like is sitting between us essentially like thoughts, that sit between us things that sit between a situations, it was wildly uncomfortable. Like, I remember being like God, I wish I had a drink like and I don't think
often but I was like this is tough but it was also the best thing we could have ever done because I think
It released it released, both of us from any shame that we had about any of those thoughts or situations or feelings, you know, even to talk about like past people we've been with or like both of us had been relationships prior. And, you know, you feel like there's loose ends at some point, like, to be able to say that to the person that you're with. Like, I feel like I sold Loose Ends. It's really hard because especially when you have a lot that you're doing together, you know, we were building a business together, we're doing all these things. And then we're like, okay, well, how can we handle this to clear up these things? And we talked about it together?
And I think bringing those things to light and then discussing them as a team. It just set the tone for the rest of our relationship. And I think it also created an environment for both of us. Were we felt like if we can tell each other all these things in the beginning of like things were ashamed of or things that sit between us are like false, we have that we've never shared.
Then like this can be a really great marriage. And both of us said, like we were terrified that we would ever end up divorced because neither of us want to go through that. You know what I mean? We both had parents that went through really bad divorces. And you know, it's not like I think I'm immune to anything, but I'm like, if I can do everything in my power to prevent this marriage from ever having that fate, then I will. And I think that that's what God will soften such. A great foot was really thinking about that from the get-go. Like not, how do I create the best marriage ever?
But how do I avoid the worst marriage ever and getting divorced and breaking up because that's the reality of life? You know, a lot of people do. So it was wildly uncomfortable.
It's funny that you say that because at another point you, when Alex was at his low you said, I feel like we could be one of the greatest couples to ever exist. When you said you'd sleep under him under a bridge with him, I'm are under the bridge.
But that's like, you know, you did see the vision for what it could become, how how do you have that
vision?
I think that there were glimpses of
both of us went in the moments that we weren't completely Paralyzed by the stress, where I felt like it made too much sense. Like one, I felt like
Even just from the very beginning. I just felt like I was I remember like the first feeling after going on a date with Alex was like he's just so interesting. I just want to keep talking to him and then after like the second the third day I remember thinking like, even if this doesn't work out, I just like want to be friends with this guy, like, I literally remember thinking that genuinely. I was like, I don't like, I would love to just be friends with him and so it felt like
In the moments where we weren't Paralyzed by the stress and we were able to relax a little bit or do something fun for like an
hour
I just could see. So clearly like there's so much Synergy between the two of us and we have complementary skill. Sets we have shared interests, we have the same values. We even have a shared family background and we both are so laser focused on the vision.
Of what we can build. And I just felt like
There's so much that makes sense here. And I in those moments, when I would see like a glimpse of him when he wasn't completely immersed, in all the stress of everything that was happening. I was like, if he, if he's saying if what he tells me is true, which is this is the most stressful time of his entire life and that he's never felt so awful before and that he's never been this stressed or not taking girls on dates like this or, you know, whatever all these things.
Then like in those glimpses, if those could become those little glimpses of time could become, what is normal? And what is our everyday, then? This could be amazing. And I remember articulating that to him and telling him that I felt that way in those moments where it felt like there wasn't any hope and we just felt like everything was going poorly and we were stressed and you know, because we're both so stressed for not great for each other. But it's, I think it's just logic. It's like we have a shared Mission, we're both.
Very clearly, mission-oriented. We have the same values. We have the same interest. We have the same family background, we have the same desires, you know? And we have complementary skills and even we have almost like complimentary personalities to each other. Like we really complement each other and have taught each other. A ton just from being different in many ways. And I was like, yeah, it would make a lot of sense that this could be something that could go really far, because I remember thinking
I just didn't see many relationships like ours and I knew that it was different but I felt like it made too much sense not to work.
What about today? Are there any relationships that you look at? And you're like oh those people are doing it right as role models.
I
think that I got rid of even looking at anybody as a role model for my relationship because in the beginning, in fact a lot of people wanted to speak to us about how to have a the best marriage ever, how to have a great relationship and to like the things that they would tell us. It was just like it was really stressful. There was like, you have to go on date night and when you go on date night you don't talk about work. There's like you have to be intimate this many times a week. You have to go and
Do these things for each other and leave this for Alex and you have to do this because you're his wife, you've got to make sure you cook from every day. Like it's crazy. The stuff that people would tell us in the beginning and I think both of us got so caught up in like well some of these people have been married for 20 years like maybe they're right and they're pretty successful you know and every time that we have tried to play by someone else's rules, I feel like we've lost hmm But every time that we have sat down and had a conversation of like what are our rules
That we want to play by in this marriage. We have been so happy afterwards and I think that's how we've done it to even. Just like to date is we don't look at anybody else's relationship, we don't read any books, we don't do anything, it's just like, I mean, I'm serious. It's like what is going to work for us and what works for us is not works for other people. Like, we're weird and like, he's a weird guy. He buys like a million pairs of shoes every month and try them all on and like, I'm a weird girl. Like, I'm like
Walking freaking everywhere all day every day. Like we're both weird and so we don't want a normal relationship. Like, I don't want it to look like what someone else is looks like. And I think that what we have found works for us works really well, but it's all thought I would just first principles, which is, like, do we both like this? Do we both feel like this adds to our relationship and adds value to each other's lives if so then let's keep doing it and to other people. They might see it and be like, I can't believe that's how they do these things. But to us if we like it is
That a problem, you know, I don't think so. So I'm just so much more. I think I used to feel like for myself, and for a relationship, I had to do things in a way that other people would understand and accept.
I don't care anymore. I'm like I don't expect anybody to understand why I am the way I am, I don't expect them to understand how our relationship works and I don't care if they like it or not. I care if I like it.
How has becoming more well known publicly change the relationship at all? If at all?
I mean, I'll be honest. I actually think that
It might have made it even.
It has done nothing to detract from it. If anything, I think it's been interesting to see how many people think we have a good relationship and I say that because we've never tried and we've always said, like we don't want to like intensely put out a marriage content or anything like that because we don't you like what are you guys doing? Drop that like we're never doing a marriage, anything. But it's interesting at how many people actually admire our relationship. And I was surprised by that because I think it's not it's not traditional, it's also
Not what I think works for a lot of people. The only thing that I can gather is just that, maybe they can feel that. We just totally accept one another
Yeah. I mean to give you some context for my own life, my parents both work together have for the past 25 years still together. Run their own business and I saw it firsthand and when I looked at your guys as content on social media, I was like, oh, I know this is going to work out because I see it in my parents and I've seen in my parents and so that's a little nut and what I'm noticing in you guys. And what I've noticed with my parents is the same thing of like,
Love and admiration for each other while working on a mission together. And to a lot of people that seems unusual to me. I was like, this is just what I grew up with and I think a lot of people are noticing that, which is really cool.
That's cool. Yeah, I do think so. I think it's like
a lot of people spend a lot of time trying to change the person that they're with rather than appreciating them for who they are. And I think that has two more to do the person pointing the finger at somebody to change needs to point back because they're usually the one with like if you point it at anybody and say that they need to change it's like what does that say about you? And I think I've just always felt that way, you know what I mean? It's like if you're ever pointing I mean I have people call me and they tell me something about their I'm like
A point, the finger back buddy,
you I learned when doing research for this that your grandma was one of the first two teachers in Iran, female teachers. And that's a pretty cool thing. Now, you're teaching people and in Business and Entrepreneurship and about relationships. Apparently, and I'm curious, what do you know about teaching that other people might not?
And or why are, do you believe why are you such a good teacher?
I didn't even know I was a good teacher stuff.
I think that there's a few things that I think through, in terms of teaching, which is
One. I don't ever want to speak on something. I don't consider myself to be an expert on. However, Sometimes the best way to become an expert on something is to study it and to learn it and to teach it, right? And so I think a lot of
You know, things that I probably teach now are things that I started, teaching it within my companies like within Jim launch because I have run all the leadership trainings and I would be training. The team's, I would be doing all those things. The biggest lesson though, that I think I think is important for people to understand when you're teaching is who is the audience and how do you make this relevant to them? Because when I'm speaking to our team, for example and I want to share a vision
And with them they I'm sure love hearing like a great big Vision. But what's most important and what they're going to remember is what is relevant to them, which is, how does this affect this person? How is this relevant to you and your life? Why is this important for our customer service rep? Why is it important for our accountant? Why is it important? And so I think I don't know if that has translated over to content but I do think very much so about who I'm talking to when I'm making the content. You know, when I'm making
In a piece of content, who am I speaking to? And why would this be important to them? Because I think that if if you can speak to their desires and what they really want out of something, then I think they're more likely to remember what you're teaching them. So I do think that is the first piece of teaching somebody something. Now I think the second piece is something that you can't do through content, but I always look at it, like when you were teaching someone something it is, you explain something to someone, then you demonstrate it.
And then you allow them to demonstrate it back to you. And you could take them, that is how I would consider actual teaching to go like I explain a concept. I show you the concept then we break down maybe even like how did I do it step-by-step and then you now do it. And I critique you I think that people are able to extrapolate that out of the content because the way that I think a lot of my content is broken down is in a way that I would be able to hand it to somebody and say you can go do this now because I try to think through like what are all the
Simple steps needed to be able to achieve this thing, whatever, build a recruiting funnel, you know, go from zero to a million, you know, hire the best talent, whatever it may be, it's just breaking it down into steps. So, a lot of the things I put out on content have been from the things that I've taught my team, and had to break down step, by step, so that they were able to go do it, and I was able to delegate it to them. So I think that might be why the content is easier to consume or actually learn. But, you know, I wish I had a better answer because I don't really know. In fact sometimes I feel like
An awful teacher. Why is that?
Because if I was better than there, would be more people with bigger businesses, but I think I have learned, not everyone wants a big business, so there's that
as well, that's interesting. So if you're a better teacher, therefore you could show people how to get bigger
businesses.
Yeah. I mean I think I'm able to do it on with close proximity in terms of like an acquisition.com, I don't feel like that's hard. But in terms of like creating content to help people build businesses that are eight or nine figures, I think, you know, there's way more people that watch my content that are doing a lot less than that. So, is there something I'm not teaching, is it not conveyed the right way, you know, I think, I think about those
things, but you also have to consider the time frame in which
You're you're operating right? Like you you've been putting out content for less than two years, maybe less than three years. So it's like, even if you have a million dollar business then you're gonna grow to, you know, eight nine figures in hiring any yeah, no, you're right. I'm unreasonable,
I just, I don't know, dude, like I think
I'm naturally really insecure person. Like I don't like think like I still when people like
That's what was it that happened. It's like Alex always jokes about it because like every time something happens and the he's like you did that. He's like but you're going to tell me. It's actually because of this and this and this actually this happened and this, they didn't mean to or whatever. It's like, I don't think that up myself like there was one time when we were at the gym and a guy came up to Alex. He was like this Layla compete and then he came up and I came up, he was like, do you compete? And I was like, No. And I was like, why are you like Rudin was like, he's just trying to make me feel better? Because I'm so out of shape.
And he was like, Alex was like, are you fucking psycho? And I was like, no, I'm serious. He was like, literally, this is your problem with everything. He's like, you always think this about every facet of life is like you just don't you just have this like whatever you see is like not reality and I'm like it's not the first time I told that so
well in some sense it's really good when you're not operating with reality because you can create reality to that place often, but it can be bad because
You're not seeing what's true. And so, how else has that been difficult for you to navigate through?
I think it shows up in terms of like, you know, in running the company. One thing that I have to constantly work on is being more decisive, you know, because I hire people and I'm like, I'm going to bring in people who are cut tons of experience, they're very smart, they're sharp. And oftentimes I feel like, damn, I think they're smarter than me. So, you know, when I'm trying to make a decision and I have five Executives who are very smart and opinionated and I'm like, hmm.
You know, and I it's I find myself like wanting to make sure that there's almost consensus rather than being more decisive in the moment and calling the shot. And so that's been something I've had to work on a lot more is like instilling in my sense, mice in myself, a sense of confidence that I'm qualified to do these things and make these decisions and I think like my default is usually that of insecurity or paranoia that I'm not. And so I overanalyze and
Gather too much information to try and overcompensate for that. I don't think that's a bad thing. I'll say this, I'd rather be that than overly confident, but I don't think that that always sends the best message to the team if I'm not very clear on leading the way. And so the last year I would say, I told the team that that's my focus is I want to be more decisive. I want to make decisions faster. I want to understand that. Not everyone's going to agree with all the decisions I make
And that's been my primary driver. I think for the last year has been like I just need to keep working on improving. That
one reason why someone might not want to make decisions is because they don't want to fail like Sara Blakely talks about at her dinner table when she was growing up. Her dad would ask her where did you fail? And that was actually a good thing because if he didn't have anything, if she didn't have anything to report, he got mad at her and so that was a way to show that failure was
Good for you. What are what are some of the ways you think about how to become more decisive and how to be more confident in your
decisions?
I think.
For for me, what helps me in becoming more decisive right now, has been being able to take different perspectives of different people in the company. If I were the person say I'm in the accounting department, or I'm in the media department and I'm this far away from Leila. When she shows up on a call and comes off indecisive, how do I feel when I'm an executive and I'm talking with five other
And we're all talking about the same decision and Layla doesn't call the shot. Do I respect her more or less? And so for me what's always been a driver has just been, like, I want to be the best possible leader for the people that are on my team. And when I take their perspective, and I think that I'm actually
So, I would say, like, you go like humility goes in two directions, right? Where it's like, there's completely going. Then there's like complete and security. It's like where I'm taking it too far to that extreme that. It actually might be making people feel less secure, right? Because of the way that I'm coming off, that motivates me to act differently because I care a lot about ensuring that, there's a healthy sense of leadership in the company. And so I would say that that's the first thing in terms of actually making the decisions.
I think that most of the time I panted out with the long-term vision of the business, which is which decision is going to benefit us both in the short term and in the long term and if none of the options can benefit both in the short-term and the long-term, I need more options. I don't know if nothing. I'm ignorant to what they are. And then I need to go out. I need to talk to people who might know, I need to network, I need to get with like the smartest people that know, about whatever the subject is. And I need to figure out what what are
More options that I'm not even thinking of. And so that's usually how I go through making decisions, which is like, basically, if the options in front of you, don't get you a win today and a win tomorrow. You need more options.
Yeah. That makes a lot of sense and it also relates to something. I've heard you refer that John Mackey has said, which is like creating win-win wins, which is like win for you, when for the other person and when at large for the whole ecosystem. Is that correct? Yeah, talk a little bit about
that.
It's really when you're building a business, especially one that you want to be really large, you have to think about the impact you're having, and I think that a huge skill of people who are great leaders is, it's truly a skill, is the ability to take different perspectives. And so, when he's building Whole Foods, he's thinking, what are the people who are living in the communities where Whole Foods exist, thinking about Whole Foods? What are the customers that walk into Whole Foods, thinking what are the cashiers thinking? What are the? And he's able to put himself in all those four?
Active. And I actually think that's one of the things that I can say, I'm very good at is taking all the perspectives. If a position, not calm does X Y, & Z. How is the general public that watches the content. Going to perceive us how our future candidates going to perceive us, how are our current Partners. Going to perceive us their team's going to perceive as, how's my team going to perceive us, both on an executive level, and a lower level. How's my family going to perceive as like, what's Alex going to think, you know? Like and I think if you can take all those into perspective and then you're able to
to go through and say, okay well how could I make this decision one that it creates a win for every single person aligned
And I think that a lot of the times we get lazy and we just think in the beginning, I think business are just think, like, what's a win for the business and they don't think necessarily even about the customers or the employees. And then I think they take it one step further and they say, how can it be a win for the business and the customers. But they forget about the employees and then when they level up even more, they think, how can I make this a win for my business? A win for my customers and a win for my employees.
And I think that the winds beyond that are thinking about the levels of employees, the future employees, the future customers the community in which you do business, the other people who are watching you, they're just fans of the business. And so I think it's just being able to think beyond your current perspective and frame, and I don't know if you can do that without interacting with all those people. So, I think that's why, you know, I talked about, like, one of the jobs of being a CEO. I think a lot of people bash me for my calendar, when I showed it.
Like that. You saw that so shitty, what we should be and the way that that tweet was written was not great. It also was a Ghostwriter and then I approved it nonetheless and I didn't read it because I was being lazy. And so I felt shitty about it is. It wasn't written while it was kind of arrogant. I felt bad about it. But nonetheless, the calendar itself? I look at my job as to understand everybody in the organization and everybody that interacts with our organization enough, to be able to understand them,
Spective about because I think it makes me, it helps me make better decisions. So that every time I do make a decision, I know that there is a more likely chance it will make everybody's lives better. Not worse.
Was that skill of gaining perspectives of everyone involved in holding multiple perspectives in your head, something you've built or something, you were born
with, I think that it comes from a few things and it's really just practice. I think that the more
People you interact with and the more people you seek to understand the more easily, you can take new people's perspectives. So, two things that I've done in my life at high volume sales was the first thing that I did. So for years, I did Fitness sales. You someone sits in front of you, you have to understand their perspective from their perspective. Why is this going to or not? Going to work, right? And what are they thinking? And feeling in that moment and that makes you more likely to help them come to, whatever, religion, resolution or plan. They need. The second has been hiring, which is sitting across the table.
Ville. Thousands of ten people. Like, should they take this job or not? Are they qualified for the job or not? And is this really who the job they want? And I have to be able to understand that person enough to be able to try and help make that call with them because I see it as my job of like, informing them just as much as they're informing me. And I think if you've done so many reps of that, plus meeting people all the time getting to know people networking, all those things. It's just a matter of you understand humans better.
You can more likely predict the behavior of a new person because you can associate it with the behaviors of past people,
I've never thought about the similarity between sales and hiring before. But if you think about it, hiring is just a form of sales, a form of telling this person, are you going to a good fit for this job? And that's like, that's a really remarkable thing. What are some of the similarities that people might not know about both of those two facets of Life hiring, and
Owls, that have served you.
Yeah, I mean I think that
Sales. Just like the it's commoditized in terms of like in as a function like sales, right? Like you are getting somebody to take something. I think that I look at sales as like a greater like selling somebody on something. Right. This is an idea, a concept, taking action, not just like a product. I view it very much more simply than it is. I think it's like they want this thing. You have this thing. Are they a match?
And truly I've approached when I did sales and I was one of the top people in sales and I also hold the record for the sales. We did Jim much, and in terms of hiring approaching with that perspective has been more helpful than anything for me. Because when somebody comes in to a position, not calm and say, they want to interview for a job, I'm not thinking, how do I convince them that this is the right job? I'm thinking, how do I explain the job? So in
Italy and set such good expectations for how it really is in this company that they have a crystal clear idea of this, this is for them or not and I felt the same way when I did Fitness sales which is like I just want to. So intricately explain what is going to happen and set the expectations that they can decide if they, if that is what they're looking for or not. And if it's not then that's fine. And so I think that a lot of people look at them very differently. And I think a lot of sales is more of coercion than anything, which is like, how do I get someone to say yes in the moment.
Moment and then they're going to back out later or they're not going to be committed or they're going to have a bad experience and that's because a lot of people I think try to use different persuasion tactics, they can get people to say yes and pay them. But does that mean that person is successful in their program? That's another story more than likely not because when people feel that they were coerced into something, they usually go the opposite direction which is they end up hating you. And I think that's what a lot of sales is nowadays, and I hate seeing that. And like, we really
With an acquisition.com to help people understand what the differences and not have that kind of culture in their organizations. But it is really comments like get him to say yes. And it's like that's what we think is a sale. Like, I'm pretty sure that. What if we treated marriage that way, let me just get her to say. Yes. And then and then thereafter every month. She hates me right? Like that would be terrible but I kind of think of it the same way. Yeah. I
actually think culturally we're shifting more from like the sleazy way to like one that makes
Both parties feel good. I think about like the pickup artist movement of like the 2000s and early 2010's and I think about like how poorly that I don't know how familiar you are with that but like it's just like let me sleep with a bunch of girls and that's a good thing and let me convince them that I'm worthy and it's like what is going on there? Like how is that ever something that's accepted in society that people would actually sign up for
And like this probably similar in sales as well of like like people getting you to say yes to a transaction. And I think a reason for this is because we're more connected than ever, you can't just screw over anybody, when you are connected to the entire world, the entire world is going to can possibly see that you screwed over that person which leads to more accountability, which leads to Greater outcomes for
everyone 100%. And I mean, I agree with you. I think that it's, it's very
be transactional and its nature. And I don't think that it is. I think I see companies that use those tactics and they end up failing at some point in time because you're not thinking through like, is this best in this moment and in a year from now, right? Like that's really what it is and I think that people can feel that within in companies in terms of like as an employer hiring people and as a customer buying a product that person I think people feel like pill they don't know that I'm
You know, just getting them to say yes or whatever those from a little white lie. It's like no people find out. People are much more intuitive than you think. And I think that people can feel that from the other side and so, yeah, I agree with you. I hope it is Shifting, it's tough
speaking about intuition. When Alex was thinking about starting the software company, you had an intuition that this was definitely the wrong idea and you acquiesced in that
Moment One, why'd you acquiesce to what he wanted and to how'd you know it was the wrong decision to go down that
path. Yeah I look at that as
It was a very big learning moment for me because a lot of our relationship at the beginning, you know, we've learned to work together very well over time.
But I think that, you know, in the very beginning, what was the biggest thing that I had to learn? Was how to speak to Alex, and how to speak to him in a way where I might have a contradictory opinion that wasn't going to, you know, be aggressive or defensive or any of those things. And I think in the beginning, it's like you don't really know what to do. You're just like stop you know, because he's loud and he steamrolls people or used to back then itself admitted by the way Steamroller.
And so I think that we've done a really good job of learning like we noticed that when we made decisions where we both spoke up and we compromised, we came up with the best decision. And so we've learned over time to Value each other's opinion because we realize that when we both bring our opinions to the table and we find a way to integrate them both into a decision. We tend to make better decisions. And so, and that, by the way, goes for companies to companies that have
more people that help, you know, I could same old the decision tend to make the best decisions. And so we've seen that over time at that point in time, I think that we had made a lot of progress and then this decision came and it felt I think higher Stakes because we did invested a few million into the software and Alex had been the one primarily because he's usually like a 0 to 1, right? So, it's like product Market, fit how we going to solve this thing? That's like, what he's sweets out. Obviously offers leads.
And then it's like I kind of came in and I was like, I don't really, like think this is going to work like, for, for these reasons and we had probably like the biggest. I think, like the only fight that we've had, it was like, two days, straight of, like, are we going to do this? Are we not going to? And I think that I wasn't
Skilled enough at the time to communicate more effectively my perspective. And so I felt like it was like hitting it. Like I was almost like beating a dead wall and at the end of the day, it was already rolling. And so then I think when you don't make a decision, you kind of just stick with what's happening which is like it's already going. And so that's what we did is we just let it continue to go. And I think that in order for me, if I had not felt like that was a good idea.
To stop it. I would have needed to be more articulate. I would have needed to learn how to communicate more effectively, my perspective on the matter. And I would have needed to take Massive Action, much more quickly. And so I didn't and I don't regret it by any means. But I think, you know, I promised myself after that happen that I'm not going to do that again because, you know, it's not that the business was a bad idea. It's that building a third business. When you have to others is very hard.
And that its timing and context. And, you know, I think that's why we talked about shiny object syndrome because we've lived it ourselves and it was I hated it. I didn't feel like I could be a good leader to anybody because I was trying to lead three at once, and I remember just thinking, like God, how easy would it be to have one business, you know? And so I think that's why I acquiesced is like
I at that time just didn't know how to articulate it in a way that would resolve the matter in a way that I would feel would be also good for our relationship. Like, I didn't know how besides, like, what stomp my feet and yell, like, I just didn't know because at that point and I mean, he said this, you know, he kind of steamrolled me. He was, like, we're doing this, like, very like just like we cannot back down. Now, we are so far in this and I was like, whee
It's not going to work, you know, and so we kept doing it and I don't remember the second part of your
question.
You answered it. Well. Okay. But I was curious like you've mentioned a couple times like that you've gotten better as a communicator and that you wouldn't have communicated that way. The way that you did today and I'm curious. When was that like to give context to it? How long
ago were I was 19. So four years
ago, four years ago, not that long in the grand scheme of of life and I'm sure you've gotten better as a communicator since then.
How have you gotten better as a communicator? And how would you have handled that situation today?
I think that.
I, I do a lot of things intuitively that end up working out for me, in terms of like people, like how do you become a leader? How do you make a decision? Some like my natural set of ethics and morals is one that has set me up for success in this role and in what I do and a lot of me like my life and making content has been like why does what I do work? I don't know and you until you figure it out you have. You can't teach it. And so it's been really great making contacts. I can figure that out.
I think that when I used to go to Alex, a lot of times I'd be like I don't think this is going to work, it doesn't feel right to me. I can like this. It doesn't feel right. I don't think they're the right higher, but I couldn't point to data, he knew that there's a lot of times where he's like, she's right when she feels this way about something, but I didn't know how to articulate. My feeling comes from this set of data and Ashley, let me show you this data, I'm going to present it to you. I'm also going to present to you and that's what I realized is that
That it's very hard especially for like a female to communicate with male in terms of like my feelings and and I also don't communicate like that anymore at all. I don't ever say my feelings anything because I don't care it like it's not relevant but it's like these facts support that you know, this business probably won't work, which is at the time. What happened was that? I started taking software readings books about software. I joined a group that was like
450 software Founders, I did went to the event, all these things. And what I learned was the, how you have to properly code software and so then, when I did an audit of a code, I realized that we had built it wrong. And so, our code was built in a way that it was going to be very hard to scale the business. And the only way is to basically, basically what it is is you accumulate, what you call, technical debt. And the only way to be able to scale the business Beyond a certain amount is that you have to rebuild it, and we had just spent 2.5 million dollars.
Building it and I was like only crap it's built wrong. We need to rebuild it and I didn't even know how to communicate that. I was like this isn't going to work there. I've seen like these other companies I'm talking to like it didn't work for them because they just didn't build it right. And I didn't even know how to articulate because I think I was also. So stressed when I communicated it to him and worried about what he was thinking that I left out important facts and I'm just going off of like me feeling like it's not gonna work. And now I've realized that I have to
Out of the information. I've got a present data and a logical argument that is supported by evidence to show why my opinion is what it is, or why the feeling is there. It's like the feeling is based off of evidence, so you have to go and find the evidence and show the evidence rather than lead with I feel a certain way.
Yeah, that makes sense. But your feelings led to the accurate result? A lot of time, your intuition was correct. Yeah. Why? Why is your intuition often
correct?
I think it's pattern recognition. Hmm. So I think that
if you've been in similar situations before you are, just recognizing patterns that can be helpful. It also cannot be helpful and I will say this which is that like more things work than more things don't work than they work. Like lots of the times we have ideas and things that we want to try an experiment in business. Many of them won't work more than they will work. So I have a lot of evidence to support things that don't work. Now I also have I think that I'm more balanced now, in terms of like, I can also identify things that
Work much more easily than I used to, but I think it's pattern recognition, it's like I'm so close to the details in the business of when things don't work. This is what they looked like, right? And so then I can take that and be like this looks very close to that other time. Things didn't work, it doesn't look like it's worth pursuing because the likelihood it succeeds is lower, right. But I don't think that a lot of people know what that means. It's like when you meet somebody like I just got a bad feeling about that guy. It's like you mean that there was a guy in the past that similar character trait
It's that you had a bad experience with. And now this guy reminds
you of him.
Yeah, that's a good explanation. I think what's also remarkable about that story is that you, you were able to analyze 2.5 million dollars worth of spend and show where it was wrong or at least figure out on your own. Learn on your own, that it was wrong. That's a remarkable skill in and of itself. What do you know about learning that most people don't?
I think that the only thing that I can say is that I have always liked when people are like, this is what happened for me and this didn't work out or they're like, this is how it worked for me. And this is why it did work out. I'm like, I don't want to learn that one for myself. I'll take yours. And I've looked at it that way for probably, since I was like 20 I heard a quote and it was like, what's the difference between humans and animals? And it was like, humans can learn from the mistakes of others. Whereas animals can and I think it's hard still, but I think that
Consciously. We can make that choice. Which is like even though everything inside of me, doesn't want to believe that I am a part of this, like whatever. Something. Someone tells you, this is not how something works. Like every party wants to believe that they're wrong. I'm like, I'm going to choose not to because I would rather learn from their mistake, not my own. And I think that that saved me a lot of time because I have spent. I've avoided a lot of really bad mistakes by just asking people who have been there before and done that before, and who now have the outcome I want. And then when they're like, I wouldn't do it that way. I'm like,
like, that's all I need to hear. I won't do it that way. There's a million other ways to do it. Not gonna do it that way. What's example of that
Man, there could be so many examples.
I'll think of something. Let me think of something that's relevant right now.
I think like, in building,
Acquisition not calm. A lot of people gave me the advice of basically putting in a lot of very aggressive terms. So that we could have like override in the business to a degree and the people who are where I want to be
Gave me much simpler advice which was if you wouldn't want to eat dinner with these Founders and you don't trust them without a contract. You don't do business with them. And I was like, I'm gonna go with that one because you know, one, I'm not the kind of person. I was like, put in a ton of aggressive terms but to I was like this person who has way more experience than me in this area. Has way more businesses way further along and honestly, as a great life and they seem like great person says,
If you wouldn't do it without a contract, don't do it with one. It's like I'm going to take that advice so that was a great piece of advice. I got
that's cool. What has your dad learned about business in the past few years?
My dad. Yeah, from us.
Yeah, I mean he was Professor for all of his life and then he starts learning business in some sense or find something that he's really excited about online and I was curious, what have you taught him or what have one?
What has he learned from looking at you guys, as an
example.
I don't know specifically about business as much as I do. I just know that he has said that he admires
that we take risks, you know, calculated risks, but that we take those risks and get out of our comfort zone, you know, I think he's always expressed at that as, and I think that him getting out of his comfort zone. You know, he expressed how happy he is that he's done that because he's never felt so alive, like he does. Now, you know, I think that and my dad actually now helps out with his book stuff. So my dad is actually here right now for the
he's been busting his ass helping with the book but I think for him it was really like
A paradigm shift more than anything which is like, you don't need to make money by having a job that you don't like you can make money doing things you like and on your own. And I think the coolest thing for him was which I love is we went on vacation with them for Christmas and my dad was like, come here you got to see this. I was like, yeah, he was like, look, he's like this is how much money my books made yesterday. It was like because Amazon push some sale and it was like a thousand, something dollars and he was like how insane I used to think I
You know, how to make a dollar with my own business and now we should pay a thousand dollars yesterday. And so I think it was, I think if he's learned anything from me, I hope it's that risks aren't as risky as they seem because I will say that when my dad was faced with the situation of like do I stay at this job or it was during kova? They basically offered like an owl or they said like well we'll pay you to leave because you're so expensive and will give you an extra year of
salary and I remember my dad called me and he was like, that's crazy that people would do that and I was like, you can take it. He was like what? And I was like, you have to take it. He was like wait, what are you talking about? And I was like, Dad was like, you you're not happy like leave and he was like, I don't know. And I was like so determined. I talked to my dad for like four hours three different times and I was like I'm if there's one last thing I do on this freaking Earth. I'm going to help my dad. Get out and like
Realize that he can be so much happier, not doing something that he doesn't like doing and he ended up doing it. And I remember when he called me and told me he's like I'm gonna I'm gonna quit and it's been like I think it was I think I always messed up I think is 26 years. He was at that job and he quit and then it was like immediately after first like a little nervous and then like very quickly a sense of freedom and I've never seen him happier since, you know, and he's working probably more than he worked.
Then, but he's so happy now, you know, and I think it's feeling more of a sense of control over your own life, which I think is only found. If you're able to confront that
fear.
I learned that he had like a bunch of aches and pains and then he started working on his own business and then they went away, it's pretty remarkable, right? Like that business and working out something you enjoy, can create that result for
you, 100%. I mean, my dad was always somebody who like went to bed super early. Like, he'd be like I gotta get in bed by 9. You know what happened? He no, I'm not doing that. That's too late. My dad would text me and I was like, yeah, it's like 11:30 and he's like, I know I just can't stop working. This is so fun. I mean I just never seen that.
He would call me and he was like, I'm waking up at 3:00 and with ideas and I get up, I start working. And I'm like how crazy that, you know, he's a 60 something right now and this is the first time in his life, he's been so excited that that's how he's ever felt. And I think for me, it's helped me feel really grateful that like, from a young age, I've always had that. Now, since I was, since we started Jim launch, it's like, I'll wake up and be like, I have an idea of this is awesome, or I want to stay up late, working, because I genuinely enjoy it. And I think you forget
after doing it for long enough, that a lot of people don't feel that way. And so it just feels like
That was probably the best thing that I think could have happened for my dad. And I think I'm grateful that he trusts me enough that when that decision came. He was like you know, what do you think? And I don't take it lightly.
What did you say to him to convince him?
I think I just presented the facts as I would with anybody and I said where do you end up five years from now? In either scenario, you know, and in this scenario.
If you take this, you could be doing something you've wanted to do, you could be doing something you enjoy doing. You could be traveling more, you could have much more freedom and you also get all this money that they're going to give. That's not that bad, you know, like if there's ever an out for a job, this is the best one I've ever seen. They're going to give you a huge pile of cash. And on the other side, I was like, if you do this for five more years, like what is your life going to look like like you're still going to be there, you're still going to have to be at work all the time going in.
Seeing the same people doing this thing that you don't really like doing anymore. And how much worse are you going to feel on five years from now? Are you going to like it more or less?
And he was like, yeah, probably not going to like it more, like, just playing it out, you know, I think we have to make decisions today that affect us in the future and often times, we make decisions today that affect us in the future, based on how we feel today, not how we think we're going to feel in the future, you know?
Yeah. I think a lot of times people want to convince their friend significant other to help them along that journey and they're acting it out themselves, like they're living as
The thing that they want their other person to do but they still aren't doing it and I think that is useful, not that you should try to convince people but if you're the person that you're dealing with is some happy and you know, the reason why they're unhappy and it's like, all right, like let's and I think what you said is actually a really helpful way, you're acting out the vision that you want him to act out. You see the ways in which he's unhappy is result of the thing that he's currently doing. It's like at that point it's like you should try to convince.
Him to live in a better reality like a lot of times that goes out to the world as like, you shouldn't try to convince your family. Well, like, there are some circumstances that you should
write in their circumstances where when when the person has expressed to you what their goal is and what they want. And if you can help influence them to get that goal in a way that is aligned with their values. I don't think that that's, I think that that is a proper use of influence rather than, like coercion, which is getting someone to
Something, you know, that they don't want to do for a bowl that they haven't
expressed.
Absolutely, you know that relates to a quote you have that when I was doing research for this really hit me which is succeeding and failing both feel scary because it's a an unknown and that's really what we're scared of the unknown. Like for your dad. I'm sure there was some part of him that didn't wasn't sure what was going to happen and he was succeeding, it online business and that was scary. And you know like he's like what can this continue or so? What what about that quote like where'd that come from?
And how like what does that mean? Exactly succeeding and failing. Both feel scary because it's an unknown and that's what we're really scared of the unknown.
I
think.
A lot of people think that once you have a certain, like level of success that fear is gone. And I think that a lot of people in life, just desire to have things or have success because they don't want to feel scared, they want to feel secure and you know I can't think of a more terrifying time in my life than building our first business.
Like I were getting all this money, right? And then, my brain goes to, oh my God, what if you lose it all? Where do you put it? Whether where does it go? Does it go in a bank account? Is it going to trust? Does it go? Where do you put it? I don't know where to put it and then we get all these employees and then I think oh my God I pay 500 or 600 thousand dollars a month in payroll. Oh my God. What if one day we can't pay for that. What if we can't what if and so with any path untaken and any path you haven't taken you just you never walked.
You don't know what happens next whether it's a good one or a bad one. And so I think that to think that success also comes with a lot of security, it's like, I actually think the more success you accumulate, you can feel more secure when you have more pattern recognition of like, you know, typically you know, like these situations, the past have worked out there for these ones in the future might. And so then you can have more predictability, but a lot of the times when you're doing something that you haven't done before to attain more success, it feels pretty scary. I mean, you could even say like
You know, when I started to make content I felt awful and scared to make content because I've built this nine-figure business but I've never put a YouTube video out. And so like when I put it on her, like just posting ghost, like I don't want to look
at it. I don't want to, I don't know what's
happening. I don't nothing because I was just scared. I was like, I don't know if people are going to say. I don't know if they think it's awful. They think it's good. Like, I've no idea and it and I think that's just where our brains end up going. And so,
People always are talking about, they can't do something because they're scared and I'm like well if that would be the truth and you wouldn't be able to succeed either because success also comes with things that are scary. Like I'm sure in the future there will be things that I have to do for a position on cam. I can imagine where, you know, maybe it's the first time I go to speak on a stage of in front of ten, fifteen thousand people because the biggest stage outspoken on is like 5,000, that was really scary the first time, then when I go for a 10,000 person stayed, that's probably gonna be scary. The book launched on
A 500,000 people live on a thing. I'm scared that something will break right? And so I think that it's much simpler to understand where the fear comes from and that it's completely normal. And to be expected, when you understand that our brains want us to be able to have predictability because in that means we can predict something we can.
fight off the threats and we can keep ourselves safe if we don't know what to predict is going to happen next the we don't know what to do to keep ourselves safe and therefore our brain labels it as danger or whatever and so I think it goes for both success and failure and that they both feel scary just because we haven't walked the path that we don't know and I say it because I think for a year and a half we completely felt like we were failing and that was really scary and then we immediately went into
At a level that we've never succeeded before and that felt equally terrifying in a different
way.
Very, very cool and great place to wrap it up. I like to ask, what's a challenge. You can leave people with to help them become the best version of themselves and action step or item that they can take to become a better version of yourself. Does anything come to mind?
I think that rather than thinking of how can you become a better version of yourself and like, how could you improve yourself is? I could say, how can you stop suppressing yourself right now? Because I think a lot of people actually suppress themselves and that's why they're not happy or successful. And so, one step that you can take is think about something that you are ashamed of.
And then tell somebody.
That's it, you know, whether you post on social media, whether you tell your spouse, whatever it is, whatever that thing is that you're hiding that you don't feel proud of that. You feel ashamed of tell. Somebody talk about it, make it normal.
Thank you so much for your time here today at Laila horn. Mosey on Twitter. Instagram to. Yeah. Acquisition.com. Anywhere else. We should send people to connect with you further.
No, I think you covered it. Awesome. Thanks. Danny. Thank you so much.
