objkt and Its Path to the Largest Nft Marketplace on Tezos

We were actually planning on integrating the features that we built on object a bit into the hand thumb, warmer hand ecosystem, but we find that to be a difficult and and and we figured let's actually much much simpler to to build a rune and and that's where also our Ambitions grew to building something even more powerful, even more open than just the one token. And that's how we, you know, built the market place that it is today.

Today's guests are the founding team of object. That's 0. BJ K t.com., The largest tasos and of T Marketplace as you all likely. No, I don't have nft laser eyes, meaning, I currently own FTS on ethereum, tasos, Solana and Avalanche. So why tasos in my mind if you take P FPS and gaming and lefties out?

Equation and are just looking for any artist minting on a green chain. There is no bigger chain than tasos and object as the marketplace on taz's. Now, it's important to mention that Han, of course, was the first and empty Marketplace on tasos. And really should get a lot of the credit for attracting the amazing talent on tasos today, but they've had many stumbles and object has emerged as the dominant platform. That also gives you the ability to search and buy from hen. You can think of object as the Open Sea for tasos, meaning opencl.

Allows you to browse the many different ethereum based platforms all in one interface object operates in the same way, but for tasos. Now, I'm a huge fan of the artists that are on tezo. So I'm just going to name a few but they're artists such as John with all the J's heart. You Mike Shinoda Lecrae say Nicholas Sassoon, Chris Reed. What is real pixel fool and Thomas Lynde petersson just to name a few now, aside from being green. Tesla's, entities are often times more affordable.

I believe there is a lot of gold in these Hills. It's why I collect Essence in at ease and object is my default interface for finding the next big thing. All right, let's talk to the founders of

All right. So I am thrilled to have the object team here on the show. Today. I've been a huge fan from the outside and so it's going to be so great to dig into what you all are building. I think a great place to start would just be the around of introductions because we have all three of you on the call today. Brian. Did you want to start?

Sure? Yeah. Thank you very much for having us. Kevin. It's a pleasure to be on the show. I'm Brian. One of the three co-founders were all Technical and background. So I'm a software injury or used to be a software engineer.

Yeah, I'm Victor. I'm also a software engineer, and I randomly met Brian and Timothy of our Twitter crazy, it, that, that was like to start this project together. Yep. That's amazing. Timothy. Do you go by Timothy or Tim usually tomorrow or even to me? I don't really mind. Yeah. So, so I'm also one of the co-founders were all technical, you know, I worked as a software engineer. I worked in blockchain as blockchain developer before this. I also happen to be Brian's brother. Yeah.

Awesome. Well, let's talk about object. I mean, I've been using you all as a tool sense, tasos. Really appeared on on my radar, not in terms of a chain because obviously, it's been around for quite some time, but it was clear to me that last year, something very special was happening in, kind of the hen ecosystem was the first thing that I discovered and and realized that the you I was a bit lacking, you know, is very utilitarian and it was breaking all the time.

The some was like, oh you have to try object and like it's a better way to browse through this stuff. And so would love to just like start at the very beginning, like why did you create object? What was the initial functionality that you hope to accomplish with the project? And then maybe we can come up to speed on where you are today?

Yeah. So at all started to think I was on the 15th or 16th of June or something last year where Tim? And I we went out for a walk as we had done. So that's ever

Times that amount I just talked about, it's really about hand about it. And if T's I mean it was all I think for Timber wasn't as new as it was for me, but he sort of brought me into it all into the hand ecosystem, think it was in me, or maybe a bit earlier. And I was just very exciting to have that new sort of platform come up and see all that that arts on that platform was really like. And also, you know, the the fact that the

Was quite hard to use. I mean I remember going on to and and having to figure out Heidi actually list a token. How do I put one up for sale? It wasn't the terminology like the swap was not something that I was familiar with. So we went on to that walk and we were talking about it and we were like, what can we improve their what else? You know, because we figured that slightest missing something there still still a lot of room for improvement. So one thing that we were talking

And about is the offers. So having a system where you can, you know, Place offers on tokens. That's something that we really missed and the other thing was auctions so offers and auctions. Were the two things that we thought were really preventing hand from from going to the next level in terms of of the size of the of the market. And we said, oh it's that they actually to build a prototype and we didn't build the auction system yet, but we built the offer system within a day and then then

Lunch that on on Twitter and was fairly successful. So, we were quite surprised, how many people actually started using use of this site and it was called object up it. So people started using object or bit to place bids or offers on one hand tokens. And yeah, it was quite popular. So we and then we took it from there

for those that aren't familiar with with what hin is, would you say that it is a kind of a

Minting and Marketplace or kind of marketplace for an open standard of nft. He's like, how do you interface with with hen?

So hand. I think I would say Hannah is a community, not just a Marketplace or an mft standard. I think it's much more than that. But hand has built. This Marketplace is actually one of the first marketplaces for NF T Zone. Tasos where you can mint tokens and put them up for sale. Yeah, so that's how I would probably Define

And then when you think of the these minting of tokens is that complying to any particular standard or how do you view and read those tokens out the

blockchain? So the standard on tasos is called FAA 1.2 or fa to. Those are the two token standards to give more details. I think Tim would be the right person to speak about that. But yeah, hand users, one of those standards. The fa2 token standard and we read that off the chain saw.

Have an indexer that can read the chain and that indexes, those tokens, and we display those tokens. So, anybody can display those tokens, when if they have an indexer, or if they can connect to an API of an indexer

gotcha. And then, I noticed on an object, you have these different Collections. And there are all the big artists that are on here in. But then also, you group, the entire Hindi ecosystem, as a single collection. Can you can explain that that logic a little bit there?

I mean, the logic is really a technical thing because we group everything by contracts. So every single token contract is a collection on our on our page. So therefore the whole hen or all hand tokens are within the same collection.

I see. Okay, so that makes a lot of sense. So because they were minted using the hand contract. They are grouped together as a collection under in, exactly. Okay, and so will like, for example, when you think of bye.

Some of the more popular projects that we've seen on tasos, liked ezard's, or Neons, or Monsters, or ziggurats. Those are not using that hen contract to meant that. They, they come through

object as they use their own contract. So we were actually involved in some of those projects. Well, what are some of the First on tasos, to create these pfp and ft drops, and they are they all live on their own contract? So they are bespoke contracts, fa 2 contracts that live on the Chain.

There you go. Awesome. So what's the current state of when I think about using object day-to-day? I use it for it. To me. It seems like the cleanest and easiest way to browse what's going on, you know, if I want just to jump into someone's wallet and see what they're up to or an artist and see what they've created. And it's loading a lot faster than say, some of the hands of the hen kind of clones that are out there. Is that just to the, the fact that you're actually caching, and

Having local copies of all the imagery versus relying on ipfs to Sir those up. I would say that's only part of it. It's a big part in making a web page, those faster obviously to have a copy of the images and stopping them from from a CDN near to the user. But another part is definitely the the indexer and the API serving the indexer and doing some magic in there.

Very cool. Yeah, it seems to be the that was one of the big problems of some of the other sites that I've seen out. There is just the speed is been an issue. Would you say that's? That's pretty pretty common and one of the things you were trying to address. Yeah, it is. And that's basically how I first got involved in in hand after I joined. So at the beginning, hand was loading. All the data directly from the blockchain, which was making the UI slow and unstable. And then I

I built an indexer to show that it could be used to make a website like an much more stable and faster. And then that's how I didn't move down and did the same, but for objects and learning a lot through the process of your SLI, and we keep building new things in this direction and building a great infrastructure on top of which we built on objects. Yeah, one of the things I'd love to touch on.

On briefly. I don't want to really come in and in trash anyone's service, but I'm curious like when it comes to hand and all the issues is had technically and with a kind of falling over and a bunch of the functionality, kind of lacking, would you say that was just because it was kind of a one person show, was that the because I know it was open source, but it wasn't at one main primary contributor. Is that what led a lot of these other tools to pop up as they said? Okay, we want to go build something and there's a whole slew of other tools that are out there.

Or is it just that that project never really skilled from a contribution standpoint from outside contributors?

Yeah. I mean I would say that's one of the main reasons why we exist because we were actually planning on integrating the features that we built on object a bit into the hand of a firmer hand ecosystem, but we find that to be a difficult and and and we figured let's actually much much simpler to to build a rune and and that's where also our Ambitions grew to building.

An even more powerful, even more open than just the one token. And that's how we you know, built the market place that it is today.

Yeah, that's great. Well it it's been a fantastic Marketplace. I know that most people that I talk to in the in the tezo space now that our Indiana to world, I mean, they they are kind of referring back to you all as their place to show people their profiles and to, and a place to meant, as well. What kind of features and functionality? Have you added since those.

Early days product-wise was was launched in the last couple of

months. I think the big thing that launched in the last couple of months has been the minting so you can know meant your tokens on object and we wanted to differentiate ourselves a bit there. From what has been done or had been done on hand before with the open collection. So we alloy artists or creators to Mint into their own collections, which means that a smart contract will be spawned on the chain for them to maintain.

To. So that's really the big difference. And the big feature that we launched. We had a lot of other small features that we launched like the notifications and that are still very much a work in progress, but that's the main one.

So what's the advantage of actually spinning up their own contract versus just doing it out of one main

contract? I think the advantage is mainly one of provenance. So you can sort of you can group your your Creations on chain into the sea.

Sort of contract. So I think that's that's the main benefit. And also, then, once these collections are indexed, are, these tokens are indexed by other marketplaces or other apps, they can be grouped very easily.

That mean, it's basically what you were saying with the hen collection, right? Because in some sense, everything that was minted on hand, will always show up under that main contract on your site versus it being a standalone entity. There's that's right.

Yeah, exactly. So, we, I mean, obviously, we could group things on a, on a higher level.

Level, but the problem there is we would have to do that for everybody on a bespoke basis and that's just doesn't scale.

Right, right. Yeah, that's very cool. You mentioned notifications and bidding and one of the things that I've noticed is when I'm signed in and I sit there and I let the the browser just exist. I will get, you know, bids on various pieces that I own and you can see them popping up as little models in the side of my screen. I feel that notifications in general has been pretty much a

Guess you like there's been stuff that I've tried to bid on in the past where I just can't get a hold of the user. The owns it, right? Like they're not getting any notice that I've even placed what I would consider to be a pretty big good bit, hopefully. And how do you all plan on addressing that?

So one thing we're looking to do is Implement push notification so that you can actually or that, you actually a notification on your device and natively that says you've received an offer or your offer has been accepted or whatever. So, that's one thing and the

The other thing is also going down in the email route. So in the future, hopefully we will or soon we will have the possibility to add your email address and to receive notifications there as well.

That's great. I think one of the big things we need to

address as well as you know, the Clutter of notifications, a lot of big collectors or big artists or overrun by notifications essentially. So we'll need to make sure that we filter out the ones that are most important or at least have more

Capabilities for users to filter the way they want to. So, definitely a lot to work on there as well.

Yeah, that's been tricky, you know, even the, in the etherium ecosystem, when own Open Sea, I have to set thresholds for notifications because, you know, you'll just get all of these random lowball bids and it'll just like clutter your inbox, right? Otherwise. So I can imagine like getting that that tooling. Right for for setting, the proper thresholds for a notification is going to be key for

you all.

Absolutely.

How do you think about file storage? When you think about in FTS? Is it 100% ipfs? Are there other ways to store like are we've and some of the others? What are you looking at there?

I mean, right now we have all our data on ipfs. I think there's there's certain

issues with in regards to

longevity of that data. I think the good thing is is that you can, you know, ipfs, if

you run your own note. There's more or less guaranteed.

You can sustain that that data. But, yeah, I mean, I think, I think, you know, we have a lot to look into there as well. Is there

something where you're actively going out? And because I know the big scare, there is one hand went down, people are like okay, are these is in a t data data, going to just disappear? And is it something where I believe you, all stepped in, and pin that data on ipfs is we did you start hosting that as well?

Yes, so we actually, we've been

I'm doing that or we had been doing that even before and went on. But especially since Hannah went on, we started looking into that even more and making sure that these systems are very robust. So we do pin, all the tokens that we have and we try to, and we will continue to do so as long as we operate. That's what that's, that's the cool.

That's great. Yeah. I love that. It was nice to see the community step up there. It's like I feel like everyone was rushing to make sure that in it's funny in some sense. I don't know.

Y'all agree with this but like there's been a lot of chatter lately about this idea that web 3 is not really decentralized. And there's there's this this there's these Gatekeepers and they have these apis and their centralized servers. They're serving out the images, but I kind of don't think that's the point. The point is that it sits there and backed up and decentralized if you need it, right? Like it's like you. All right now with object can be performant. You can serve images really fast. You can use cdns.

You can do all the things that you need to do. But if you were to go away, all the important data is being stored in a decentralized fashion. So that someone else can fire up another version and get this up and running like with hand within 24 hours or something like that. It was it was relatively quickly. Is that kind of your take on the, the just decentralisation side of this? Yeah. Yeah. That's correct. So the same way even before hand went down, although front ends were created to let you browse the hand collection or

Things such an had such as hand next hick and also objects. The same thing Could Happen even without object going down, anyone could just leverage the contracts that we create and that store the tokens and the metadata that are stored in there to make an alternative front end for it. So the decentralized part is to folds one part is the contracts because anyone can interact with the contracts so we don't have to be there.

Are we don't have special keys in the front end and the other part being the files on ipfs and, and on this front, we are doing everything we can to make sure that these files stay there and don't get garbage collected. Mmm. That's great. I'm curious, when you think about the types of media that you will support on the minting side. I've seen generative platforms like, FX, hash, and, and obviously, our blocks on the etherium.

And there is now raindrops and this is also on ethereum of, it's more on the AI related different types of AI related art coming on on platform. Is this something that that object will eventually support is like, do you ever have a tool for generative artists to publish through you? Are we just allow third parties to kind of fill that space.

That's a very good question. And actually we have been working on on a platform to alloy for generative art, very similar to what ethics

Josh did our has been doing and and because of that, we stopped to go more or deeper into that. So we're still waiting on to the to see this unfold really and to, to see how the generative of art the way ethics has been doing. It is going to evolve and then we're happy but we're looking at ourselves. No more as an aggregator of such projects and a way to do, maybe secondary sales on such tokens.

Down to two, maybe innovate on a certain single front, but we're definitely still. I mean, we're still working together with artists and we're still exploring other territories that are very interesting to us, but I think my ethics has did a very good job there. Yeah,

that's great. I'm curious. What does it look like when you look at the data behind the scenes and you're looking at how many in FTS are being written and published per day? Like, how is that scaling? I saw something recently that said,

Ed that was talking about aetherium gas prices and they are just ridiculous, right? But in some sense, they are high there dot, there's a high barrier to public, not so much on polygon. And some of the layer 2 is obviously, but on the main chain itself, if you want to publish something like, you have to be pretty certain that you're going to either sell it or that it's going to have some type of value. Because of just the cost to publish right on other platforms Lana others where it's a fraction of a cent to put anything on chain.

That could in theory lead to just art spam and and and just to have their just be more forgeries and just issues with people not having any barrier to entry. So everything gets written to the chain. What are your thoughts on on, on that in that Texas is relatively inexpensive to publish new things? And and also around just just artists Discovery as well. Is that something that you want to put more of an editorial curation on top of so that you can highlight some of the best artists?

It's is it always going to be just kind of a word of mouth thing will eventually be driven by algorithms, like you own this? So you might also like this, how do you all think about that?

I think it will be a combination of things and then we're still not 100% sure hairand along the long term, but we're exploring and we're starting to explore and I what the options are. And of course we have been, we had to make human curation for Discovery so far. So we have like a curator only news doing a fantastic job, curating the start page and we will continue

You to do that. And we will continue to expand on that. But we're also looking into more ways to to discover art. And and that obviously goes into maybe a little bit more into the algorithmic set or algorithm side of things. But we also what we're planning to do is to have a feed where you can you know, discover the art that you're you're the artist. You follow create. And what else?

That's very cool. So that would explain why you have the following functionality. I was always wondering that. I hadn't used that yet. So does that?

Exist, I know there's that people were following me on object, but I didn't think about why I might want to follow others. Is there a feed today? If I start following other

people, there is no feed right. Now. That's still a work in progress. We've been working on it for a while and I. Okay. Yes. There's, there's a lot to be to be. I mean, we had a lot of ideas and I think we wanted to pack into many and we should have probably just released this sort of a POC. But yeah, that's definitely comment. Is something we've been working on for a while but unfortunately is not there right now.

Well, I mean given all that you've done in less than a year. I think.

Keep doing quite a good job at shipping product. It's a, you have a lot of functionality for such a, such a young company. I would say the primary function of the, the follow feature was driven by users and what they wanted, get a notification when an artist. They like means something that's the that's the first driver for this feature, but then obviously the band's, the, the field for using this follower following data.

To create a customized feeds. And when we talk about algorithmic creation, it's something that that works really well in some fields. For instance. If you have a Marketplace for closes, then it's fine to see other types of genes that you might, like for art where things are can be very different and unexpected. It's making things much harder to get, right? So you want to expose

Use us to Arts that they don't text. I doubt anyone would only enjoy Pixel Art of Photography, for instance. So feeding them what they already purchased. Are already bookmarked can be a bit tricky, but there are ways to do that properly. It's just, it's just quite hard to get, right. Yeah, I could see that. There's there is I think from a from a like you bought this.

As you might like this that I could see that would be difficult. But at the same time, the one thing that I am certain of is there are certain individuals that they buy something. I don't care whether it pertains to me or whether I like it or not. It's like I'm just curious, right? Like if xcopy comes in and buy something on hin like I want to, I want to see or object. I want to see what that is, right? Because it's xcopy. So there's there's something about these really influential either collectors or artists that if they are.

Somehow interacting placing a bid on something or buying something that, that would be of interest to me. It sounds like you kind of can just do that without algorithms. Obviously just with a fall functionality, right? Yeah, definitely. And I totally get what you're what you are saying. And again, to take the analogy of closes. You wouldn't ask yourself. Why did you buy this pair of sneakers? Why do you like them? But then, if you see someone that you admire collecting something, you might ask yourself.

Why do they find this interesting? And, and, and dig a bit deeper into either the artist or the art itself or the history behind particular piece? And I think that's much more interesting than just feeding what people already enjoy it. When you see the history behind behind a particular piece. What role do you think that social has to play in all of this and meaning that if I'm browsing through and I'm on at ezard's and there's a one very

Distinct Hazard. That I want to leave a comment on, or a have, some commentary on, is that just like too much of a slippery, slope and it opens up comment systems. It seems so web to, right. It's like just like allow anyone to come in. But how do you encourage discussion around these pieces? Have you all thought of that bout that at all? Yeah, discussion is already happening a lot on Twitter. Obviously. This card is the other place to be. If you find a service let it happen. They're like no need to have that happen on your side. Yeah. I'm not saying it's

It's a bad idea to add comments to something like this, but that's not our current focus and I don't see us adding comments any time soon, as you mentioned. It's kind of web to. And then it comes with a bunch of challenges, regarding content, moderation, and all that. So in the end will object become the Facebook of nft s definitely not, that's not something we're interested in.

I would out there, I agree with that and I think, but one interesting thing is to sort of research that topic a bit because I think as Kevin said it's interesting to have maybe comments on Art in a certain way but not be the one to make it to Facebook, where you just where you just have comment spam, of course not but to do that sort of research is definitely something we're looking into whether it's comments or maybe other features as well.

Yeah, and comments in the sense of how a gallerist would something about a piece they are throwing.

Like what the magazine would do, when talking about a particular artist and the history behind that? This is all of this is a bit around this topic and it could add a lot of value. Yeah, it would be interesting to think about how you can service discussion on other networks around pieces. Like, I'm looking at Neons right now, which I think are just absolutely stunning. And I'm a real bummed. I never bought one, but I need to make that happen today. And it'd be interesting to see if there's other

The top collectors that are mentioning this on Twitter or what are the most active discords that are that are around this particular Community. Although that would probably just be their primary Discord. There's the kind of no way to get visibility and other Discord and conversation there. But yeah, it's interesting to think about it. How can I learn? I guess I would just jump directly into their Discord to learn more. But yeah, it's a I like the fact that you all have kept it clean. It's it's easy to add features and functionality and it seems like the approach we've taken is just like

Really beautiful simple layout that I think is that some of the best I've seen, by the way, who did the design for the site?

I wouldn't call it a design. I just sort of, you know, implemented it on the go but they had what that was

me. It's, I mean, it's very well thought out in terms of just like, it being usable and just all the data is where I had expected to be. And yeah, makes a lot of sense Bravo nicely done. Do you all watch kind of? Is there a way within object to see? I didn't notice you have the trending?

That's kind of on the there are the hot collections. That's that's on the front page. Is there a way to see velocity of projects or who's being followed the most or is like, how can I I guess what I'm looking for is if I want to find the next up-and-coming artists on object? Are there any tools that I could use to try and find a you know, an artist that is gaining momentum that is gaining followers before they actually kind of blow up and become the next John.

Currently there. There's nothing that you can do your at 92 to find somebody like that. And and you know, there's a few reasons. I mean, one of them is obviously we had we haven't had enough time yet to implement everything and the others were really taking her time to think about. For example, the follower that that's something we do not show on purpose because we don't think it serves that much of a that doesn't give you any real information that we want to focus it more on the art right now, so

So when you, when you see an artist mint, mint, the peace. We don't want you to check out how many followers does he have, but we want to sort of make you more cared about what they actually meant

it. That makes a lot of sense, but discoverability is a big topic. Extremely hard to get right? And we have ideas. We are working on a few things to improve this covering both art and artists. And we will have to

Get bunch of experiments and see what works. What doesn't.

And then leveraging, the, the follow data again, can be extremely interesting to see who gained a lot of followers recently, without even showing any number or what collections got the most interests. There are things we can do without turning it into the dopamine Rush of getting a new follower or the the race to the piece with the most likes.

So we will figure something out. Yeah, one of the things that that I do inside my private proof Collective Discord is to pipe in data from really interesting collectors. So as we monitor the ethereum blockchain and anytime any collector that we've added to a list to is is purchase something or placed a bid on something or we try and pipe that data in so that people can see it. And then jump off and consume it. I haven't seen that on the

Tasos side, any type of API to feed in sales into Discord, you know, I would love to see every time a John is sold or ever the, the more popular artists that you have on the platform. Open. Seas. API is notorious for one will. It's insanely popular so you can't really blame them for it going down. I think right now is they've just they've had a lot of growth there. Do you ever plan on offering or what's the current state? And I know you're so new in terms of just like

under a year old. So but I'd love to know the plans for the API and kind of what you will. You plan to release in terms of Integrations. Is there anything on your road map there?

Yeah, you can go to data that object. I'll comment. You will have a fully fledged graphql API to access everything. That's insane. How many Engineers do you have? Currently? I don't know enough, but currently about five. I think we are under

six straight. Honestly, you must have some really amazing talent because like the fact that

You all have done this much in this short amount of time is just really

impressive. Yeah. Think we're very lucky to have Victor.

We're still a tiny company and we are, we hired great talent and we will keep doing. So I think plan Talent, it's hard work and making the right choices like taking good decisions in the software side of things. So, yeah, I think we are, we're doing great on

This front. I'd love to just as a product designer and Builder. I'd love to kind of go in a little bit deeper there. I'm curious. One of the things that over my career building products that I've always actually love to do because it's very freeing in some sense is that you sit down and as with all these get togethers with with other colleagues, you come up with what the future should look like right now, oftentimes that can be 20 30 features deep and then it's just being. I've always really loved being relentless.

And really kind of cutting out. A lot of a name, punting on a lot of things because for me it's always been about what are the two to three things that are really important right now and I have also enjoyed just shipping product. Like I'm not a fan of waiting, you know, six months to ship something or three months or even one month. It's like, how can we do this kind of continuous release schedule where we're putting a new win up on the board and something new for the community every single week or every couple of weeks. What is product development?

Like, for you all, how do you prioritize certain features and functionality? And then how often do you you ship new features? I would let Ryan Lanza. But right before I wanted to say, we are definitely on your side with this. We ship fast. We don't want to wait a long time before releasing anything want to experiment with things and and she

passed. Yeah, and and to add to that. I mean it is all very chaotic still, the whole process. I mean, we get a lot of feedback from from users through your desk.

Three Twitter to sort of synthesize that into something we can work with is really hard. So we do have our roadmap dot object or Comm site where you can, you know, ask for features or raise books, so we work with that. And then other than that, we come together at twice a week for to discuss the room up and to discuss priorities and they shift very quickly. So sometimes we have to call another meeting a week later, but, but it has worked very well for our size.

Sighs so far. So so so we try to discuss priorities as often as needed. And then just work on those and daily basically, so we're also still small enough to be able to ship things daily. So that's great. So we can just push a new bill to production and so far. It's worked great, but I do think we will have to adjust the way we worked work, when we grow.

I'm curious. When you look at how a lot of the other big Market places out there are handling the feature requests and

Feature

functionality of what they're building. Some have started to embrace like super rare. For example, they've started to embrace kind of a little bit more hands-off by the corporate entity and more community-driven moving to some type of like governance /. Dow it. Is there a world. What do you, what are your thoughts on that? Like, do you see this being as something? It's too early to even think about that or talk about that? Is it something? That is a model? You'd eventually like to embrace.

Are you kind of waiting to see and would there ever be a governance token or anything associated with your project?

Yeah, I mean, I think to go that route. You really have to be inclined that when you have to start of believe and that the web 30, do you say we have three Spirit or web three way of doing things. And we definitely have that and we definitely would like to have a token at some point. So, we're working on that. We're working on, figuring out what that could look like, but we're not rushing anything. Because we think that's a very important aspect.

Of our journey, we don't want to rush things and then not deliver on like good token, Amex or not, deliver a sensible token. So we're taking our time, but it's definitely on the roadmap and it's definitely the way we want to move forward. So we do believe in the community aspect of things and and we're very excited about that. And you know, it's all still very experimental. I think that the whole Tau movement Community governance movement is a

three experimental thing right now, but but it's super exciting and we're looking forward to to what we can do with object.

Yeah. That's that's the one thing where you can't ship fast break things and then fix them later. If we reduce the talking to the talking Amex, we need to to nail them down and then get everything right before we launch a token, but it's definitely in the plans. Yeah. There's ever a time to stop for a

And talk to legal counsel and figure out all those things. It's with launching a token. Right? Like that's the time to really make sure you're doing the proper due diligence and getting everything correct. Makes a lot of sense. I'm curious on just the tasos blockchain side. The only thing that gives me pause about Teslas. I love that. It's it's definitely certainly a more Green Technology. Everything that I saw about the kind of Indie Vibes of the early. Hin. Ecosystem was fantastic. It

Gave RS that couldn't afford to meant another platforms. A shot at having a place to do that, and I'm a huge collector. I have a lot of big chunk of my collection is on tasos. The thing that has always just kind of like, rub me the wrong way that I've been scared of is I just think about the future scalability of tasos as a chain. And one of the things I've noticed is every time there is a major launch on tezo.