I'm doing this. Won a championship Sunday.
I know. All right. Ready. Miss it again. We were thinking we were thinking to pull up the game like, as we're doing this, but whatever. Let's do it. How you doing Steve?
Now, I'm good, man. It's good. Just got off the plane came straight here from Way. New York. Nice! Yeah.
Where did you get that jacket out? Huh. Nice jacket. So forth. Okay, are you?
There is style stuff like that. Shoot, I'm the most attractive brother in the world. I got to I got to help myself.
As much as I can. I'm saying if you don't have to look at least have some style do something like you know I'm saying try.
Sorry, should we get into it? Let's do it. We got Steven. Naismith is so big that we should weaken me. I know, let's do this. I don't wanna hold you up too long. So, I've got two big stinky, let's just go. Let's just go. We gotta get right into the Lakers. Celtics last night are recording this now. Yes, we can show for it. Go ahead, man. I mean, I was upset this morning, I know they were upset seeing LeBron knock at the
Also his bullshit.
He definitely got fouled. The definitely should have been a foul called the league has publicly acknowledged. That the officials mr. Call. We understand that, but in the same breath, they walked into the game, three games under 526 losses, and 49 games. Sure. So let's pump the brakes just a little bit. Yeah. They got a bad call. Yeah, they it was the wrong call. Yes. They should have won the game. All of that's true.
It happens. How did they miss out with LeBron
James? I just told you, I said they made a mistake. They messed up. No question about it and
You would think that with him being a superstar that he is, you're going to get a benefit of the doubt. Usually, it works in Reverse. What usually happens is that somebody like him gets a call, he doesn't deserve sure but it worked in Reverse last night. It's really unfortunate. I don't like the way, the officials have been officiating. The game. I think that too much too much emphasis has been placed on a lot of player Behavior stuff like that and if you really want to be a part about it,
how about the fact that he got teed up? It was a
technical foul.
That was granted to the Boston
Celtics
because of all
his histrionics when he was called for the
foul and then get the call. Yeah.
So in overtime, they will point up because they called the tack on them there. So you made a bad call, you missed it. You cost him the game. And on top it all, you gave him attack. All of that was
wrong. You think there's anything that should be done like any punishment, maybe to the rafts for missing, stuff like that,
that's for the league office to determine. I think they look at these referees and sometimes you referees, do get punishment. They don't get the plum assignments that you would expect them to get.
There's been turnover within the officiating crew throughout the years, the same officials aren't always there. So, this punishment is just that we don't talk about them because they don't make news. I mean, really, really think about it if you said here today, okay? And, and a referee lost his job and whose reassigned to the G League or something like that. How much more than 60 seconds would you spend on the story? Nobody cares troops by the end of the day. That's what, that's what matters. That's awesome. How do
you feel about the whole?
LeBron James about to pass. Kareem does that like him passing cream? Is that gonna put them over the top of the, like the MJ
conversation? Nothing. No. Have a pretty wide. I've always made that very, very clear. I think that LeBron James on the Mount Rushmore basketball. I think he's one of the top two players that have ever played this game. He does not have the resume of Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. He does not have the resume of Bill Russell, but he still number two, all-time the reason that I don't put him. Number one is because there was too many times.
Earlier in his career, where he didn't have that assassins meant. So, 2011 is, where exactly am I? Well, that wasn't the only one, but I'm just saying that was an example. There were times we look at Jordan and we look, first of all, he's six and 0 and NBA Finals. He still has more championships than LeBron James. Even though the LeBron James has been the more Conference Championship Finals. Appearances, that's number one. Number two, the game is considerably softer now than it was in the 80s and the 90s because of the way, that's not the players fault.
Way the officials call the game mandated by the league hand, checking has been eradicated. You know, putting elbows in the back. All of this other stuff being physical, having to endure the path of resistance that MJ had to endure one that climb to the top. LeBron has not had to go through that. That's not his fault. The athletes today, one with easily all you are greater the. This game is much, much faster we get all of that, but the stiffness of competition when you look at
It is just different today than it was back then. Not to mention the fact that you know the quality of competition that you're going up against the way the game was called, the physicality. The tactics that were employed to derail somebody who was an elite player in an elite. Athlete, no longer exists. You combine all of that. With the fact that you never looked at MJ and said in a championship series he didn't get it. Done. Not one time, not once
but you can't say like the accolades, all like that.
Like, I mean for Rings the amount of Cup championships and he passes cream as a guy that's
like couple of things when it comes to basketball with all due respect. I can say what I want to say, oh
yeah,
we about that because I'm going to tell you right now, I covered these dudes, I saw it with my own two eyes and there's and not to say when you're watching it on television, that you don't see a lot because you do, but when you see stuff up close, and when you talk to his dad react,
I can't it's a different animal and listen, everybody universally respects LeBron. Yeah, one of the greatest ever but they feared Jordan bro, fear, okay. I can't really do that. He was scared and then when you think about it also throughout LeBrons tenure there has always been a debate as to who was his peer? Was it Kobe? Or you know other guys, you know Kevin Durant and don't get me wrong. I think he eclipsed that the he answered the call but there was always the question.
Ian tell me one time and MJ's career when it was even a question,
I'm too young to answer that question but I think that's where like the debate kind of goes because you see for yeah I
respected debate but I think the debate is for folks with youth folks who are a little bit older. Yeah. Yeah. Who watched MJ? Yeah. And watch LeBron. No you're right. Yeah the shadow of a doubt and that that's what it was and so and I also think this
They've asked me about Kobe. Come on. Kobe isn't in that conversation. He's got more chips than LeBron, James. And I said, my response was Kobe's, not even number one of his position and we all of that.
All you guys think about MVPs and like comedies, want no I got the job.
Just I'm not even talking about that. I'm talking about just watching the game. With the eye test is great and it's phenomenal, as Kobe was nobody ever said, he Superior to m.j. and they played.
Ethical positions and had an identical style of play. LeBron James is unquestionably the greatest more photos ever played the game. Yeah. Ever. Now of course, that's better than Bird. That's better than everybody. Yeah. That everybody. Yeah. But again when you compare them to m.j., there's nuances that you take into consideration and all I could tell you all is go back and talk to the players that went up against him. They feared and m.j., nobody feared LeBron. They respect them, profound respect for them but nobody feared them, you walked.
To an arena used like, damn, I got to deal with this dude. I want no parts of him. Yeah, you were so scared and m.j., you would depress the night before. Thinking about going up against that brother,
it was an area for that. You seen it in response to that real quick? How come you think? It's always because you watch both players, right? Why is it always talked about the physicality aspect but they don't focus on like today's game there's obviously more Talent. Well, I do. You know what? That's a good question. I don't know
why they don't Focus.
Focus on today, being about it being Superior talent. I think I'm guessing because, In fairness to you, I've never even asked that question to anybody else. And I should have, I would surmise that the reason why people do that is because it's the period as today's athletes. Are, you can't get away from the fact that they're helped tremendously by the way. The game is called. Let me give you an example. I believe that Steph Curry is the greatest shoot of God of a crime.
Yeah. Okay I don't think that's an argument but I'm just saying we see him whatever. So let me share a conversation with
you that I had with Isaiah Thomas,
Isaiah Thomas said
to me one time and he loves Steph Curry. And thanks to Steph, Curry is the greatest shooter ever blah blah blah. He said, if he was playing and I era he would not have averaged more than 18 points a game,
okay. And I said, how that's blasphemous? Yeah, that's flatly. No, don't say it.
Listen, let's do this, bro.
There's a reason this two-time Champion said that, yeah, the rules would have allowed them to rest on his shoulder and to be physical with him, in such a way, that he wouldn't have been able to get the shot off. Uh-huh. Okay.
The rules would have allowed that when he came through the paint. We were going to make him feel us, and he wasn't going to be in any condition to run around as much as he can. Yeah, the way you're explaining, yeah.
If you remember the first few years that Carrie was in the league, what was his issue?
He had? Ankle problems. Yeah.
Remember, they had to work through that, it was like four or five years, and his fourth fifth year in the league. There were legitimate questions as to how long with his career last because he kept getting these ankle injuries. Well, those old-school guys said well, what do you think? We would have done to that? You think we would have just let him run by us and said we had been
In them, we did, we did that, we have been doing everything, he would have felt knees. He would have felt elbows. We would have tripped, and we would got physical with him. And we would have gotten away with it because of the way the game
was called, and what was allowed.
So, when you hear that all of a sudden, now, you have to think you have to look at
dudes in different light. When you look at a guy Eddie Johnson does Sirius XM radio, you know, in the afternoon, our MBA radio, he was averaging like 17, 18 points a night and people
Who Revere him. Why? Because his toughness? You look at guys like Oakley. Remember the old days with Maurice, Lucas and people like that. They went forces
whose in enforcing now there's no such thing it's not allowed, right? You look at guys like you know, it bird coming up. You looked at dr. J. And it's like, wait a minute, the physicality that existed,
what they would try to do to
derail you physically and
what you were able to overcome the Showcase your great.
- that is what they're talking about. So when they bring stuff like that
up, that's
what I'm saying. Okay, it makes sense.
Now, I think to going off that Steph Curry. Like in that sense he's probably not going to play as confident, mentally. If he knows he's going to, it's more physical game. Sure thing nowadays, he's probably pretty confident going to get the call. He's protected, 18, somebody shooting, right? Yeah. You ever see a chute and
sometimes they just run at you and they act like they don't hit you and your lower body is something like their stomach down
flinch.
Exactly guys in today's game followed through, with no problem, because it's so rare. That, that happens guys, back in the day with flinching a heartbeat and wouldn't follow through, because they knew they were gonna get hit. Yeah. So it's like, it's literally, it's not literally, but it's almost like a in football or why receiver going over the middle and you're waiting for a mica
pauses in today's game or Ronnie Lott. Back in the day, or whatever the Jack, Tatum back in the day,
Paralyzed Darryl Stingley God rested. So
stuff like that. When you see guys and you know, the intentions
are to hurt you, you're
the they are out there to do
nothing else. But to punish you
all of a sudden you that receiving now you got alligator on. Yeah, you're scared because you know, you're going to get
popped. That's the conditions under which those NBA players had to play to a lesser degree. And so when they bring that up and they say, don't
talk to us about,
Toughness, the best way, they could bring
it to, you know, give you some clue as to what they're thinking is when they say, well, if Jordan was playing today he'd average 60, why are they talking about that?
The athletes are better. They're talking about the way the game is called, and how
soft it is compared to how it was once called,
that's why they think it averaged 60, because you're not allowed to do with so much, you can't hand check. You can't grab, you can't body
them up, you can't impede their progress. You got to give them a
Safe place to land once they elevate and launch, they got to have, they got to
come down with a safe place
to land, what a stuff, Al
all of that. And so they say if Jordan had that available to him, if most of the players back in the day, had that that was score has
had that available to them, they'd be exponentially
better and I were talking about it that way. Like, if Jordan got the calls today, they never say that but they talked, well, they say it to me. Yeah, sure it to me. So God
sends it to me. I want to
ask you, cause you're obviously very active on social media. Do you pay attention to like the whole LeBron, like lockup stuff?
I'm active on social media from the standpoint that the work that I do. I make sure it's not just put out on ESPN,
you don't see you don't see the little caps up. I don't pay no attention. OK. Nah. Come on. He waits a LeBron like just lies. He lies about a lot of things. Like it's like white lives. Like a lot alike. No, no. Come on, man. He's talking to Steve. He's saying to there's a there's a, there's a wide bro. Do you do sir? How old are you? I'm 21. You have any idea how old I am not
I've been watching for years, but D5, bro. Yeah, but it's hot guy tells me stuff.
Now, okay, let's see this. Have you seen the clip of LeBron walking in with like he's on the first page of every book when he walks in and they always capture that? I swear to come on, man. Not where do you see this? I've never seen it but how, okay, just in response to that, you don't think that now that you're covering and being more involved in social media, it's not important to be more on like that side of things at all, you only want to cover, just what happens in the game. It's not that, it's not that, it's not a matter of me,
compartmentalizing and saying, I don't want to cover something anything like that.
I'm
Literally working throughout the day. Yeah, so I got stuff to do and people will alert me to something that's percolating and then I say, okay, let me take a look at it, if I have time, but it's just like, I used to be at a, I would
tell you before my mother passed away in 2017. God, Rest, his soul I was at an average of 125 NBA games. Wow. Wow,
easy, right. I was always at the games,
Has
happened is Demi, take. I'll be doing a lot of shows. Yeah. So I'm stuck in studio because one of the reasons that I've had the
relationships that I've had with players in NBA and professional football
personnel and stuff like that throughout the years. Because they saw me at the games, I was the type of person that I'd go to a football game. I'd go there just to be there. Pregame see some of the players coaches, you know what, I, you know,
you want one holler at me lady, just call me later. I catch you later, whatever. Or they'd be like, yo, Steven, they make sure you meet us here at this parameter satisfied after the game, but that's all.
All I'd go there and stay
there for a half or whatever I go home. This is, I mean, you know, or I'd go to a game really late or leave the game really late or whatever. The case may be. I'm constantly constantly on the Move. What has happened is that ESPN's got me doing so many damn shows that I'm in studio and so, because I'm in studio, I can't get to the games away and then when you're doing content, okay, well I did this one linear television, but I
Have social media platforms to post my work.
And if I have a few
minutes, I might look
online. And I might comment about
something here there just to show people. Yo listen, I'm trying to pay attention. I'm busy but I'm act you know, I got other stuff to do but I don't have time to be following stuff like that. You got to tell me because I don't know. Do you know the other day with some blue not the blue. Check with the blue
tag on Twitter, whatever. Yeah, that that means that, that means that the story.
Is false. Something like that? Some blue. I don't know what the hell it is.
I haven't seen happen. Okay. Do you know I just found out about that three days. I didn't you're telling me you knew before, I don't know. Somebody at ESPN told me this three days ago. I
don't pay attention to that kind of stuff, guys. I really do,
but that's that kind of stuff that we were talking about the low Capsule. That's the stuff that ESPN and Sports Center posting every day. So but I'm saying like Darius, Garland might go for 35, you're not even seeing that. You're seeing a sort of he went for 35.
In terms of how tspa utilizes, I don't know that. Yeah, like look I'm producing content for ESPN. So I'm not paying attention to some other things that they might do from time to time. They alert me, I have
access to it if I want to write,
but do I see it without being alerted know because I looking for what I'm saying, do you think that the more culture and that kind of Social Media stuff is kind of outshining what's actually happening on the court sometimes? Like with players you might not even I guess that's possible. But
ultimately it comes back to
The person producing content, okay and Darius garland would it matter if he wasn't an MBA Luna for Marie and then be a uniform, we can have it alongside Donovan Mitchell. Hmm? See, the reality of the situation is that you're talking about ancillary things that are in addition. Sure to his great play, on the court, I'm the person that's looking at his great, play on the court, got it, I'm not focused on all the storylines and stuff like that. I might have been a like, like when Tristan, you know, hooked up with
Khloe Kardashian, what?
Might have been the last no reason. I'm looking at the fact that damn, he's on the court. He need to grab some rebounds. What's going on here? Why do I need him to do this? I need him to do that. I'm not saying that. I don't know. I'm saying that I'm late to the party on that. Maybe that's a cause and effect so take it doesn't it doesn't, it doesn't involve my job like what Tristan's doing off the court translate? I'm not denying that. Yeah, but what I'm
saying is that for me, what I do write down doesn't affect me because when y'all when y'all are looking
In at me on television or listening to me or radio, or whatever the case may be, it's based on their level of production will. What they do? You see what I'm saying? Ain't nobody coming to me, looking for me to comment about what's going on outside of
that hundred percent. So that's I'm like, I'm giving the audience, what the audience expects from me? Well, damn it. This dude is
playing. Sorry. What Stephen A got to say, why he think this dude playing like that, whys he looking like that, that's what you're looking for from me. You ain't looking for me to Tristan hooked up.
Everything has a about they should come to come to you for that to see reaction. Wow, me I
would refrain from commenting about cats, personal life because that's just not my style. Yeah. And not only that, I'm not going to lie, you coldly chauvinistic or what do you what do you want? But there's just certain things. It's just man coach, you know, it's like, is it involves your relationship with somebody else? Ain't none of my damn business, you know, now
you play, like God, what I'm gonna go like this and if I saw you with it, if I see,
I saw you hanging out 12 in the morning and you play like trash. Then I'll be like this.
And what was you doing this? But that's all you ever say. Yeah, it would be, it would be a clue like to let you. It'd be like letting him
know. Look, I know why. The hell you messed up last night? Gonna say it, but I
know why you're giving ways that they like, they didn't give me the side eye, that's my way, you know, sometimes because you got to do some living a lie, if you're not writing their face. So sometimes I give him the side. I like, what the hell were you doing last night? Cuz they know, I know, like, if I say, if I say something like that. Yeah,
they'll be like damn, that damn, Stephen am. Sorry as he saw me, they love you, but
they probably won't do it again.
I think of them aside. I yeah, yeah that's a love-hate because of
that. Yeah, because I but they know I would never say anything. Of course it's just that I would be it would be my way of letting them know. I
know why the hell you look like you're a snitch though? I know that. Yeah, I know. Has there
ever been a time? Has there ever been a time when a player's gotten like really pissed at you for like something? You said, oh, plenty of times, but it was like, but it's awkward. It's always
evolved in the support. There's no one no one that we'll ever.
I say Steven A revealed my personal stuff. I don't
roll. Like, what is there? Ever a story of someone that like you saw them out like after you made a comment or anything like that? Like they've tried to press you.
Oh yeah. Plenty of times. I mean Alan, I was in and out of this big for eight months, Glenn Big Dog Robinson. And I got into it after Randy is got five many years ago. You know, DeMarcus Cousins didn't like me too much but there's other players. LeBron D Wade.
Draymond various others Colby's. Oh god! Kobe Chris, Paul Cobia, Chris, Paul with my nightmares. But all of those players that I mentioned Westbrook, all of them, they approached me like men told me what they felt and why I gave them opposition. If I thought they were right about something, I'd going to are correct myself.
I've always if I thought that we would, if I thought they were wrong, I stood
Pat. It's just that simple and
And should I'm trying to think.
But yeah, that was about it. But they come up
to me and they express their point of view. And once they do that, I'm good with it. I always have been. Yeah, I've
always loved that about you, man. Like you've always it's about sports like it's never outside. Like, you mentioned, like the Khloe Kardashian like this, none of your damn business. None of your business. I've seen I've seen an interview with you and LeBron as well. Like, a long time ago, was I think it was like 2005
now has about 2,000
2002. Yeah, it was
like around that time but I remember he was like very up-and-coming in the league and stuff, but I've always liked Wonder, like, how was it like have you seen LeBron? Have you like, like, you know, said, what's up Tim? Yeah, you guys want to see? The did that last time? You two, he came up to me and gave me a hug when we were at the game and my
slaw and the whole bit, I mean we don't talk or nothing like that but it's respect. He knows I got a job to do. He knows I'm not going to kiss his ass. I know he's got a job to do. I know you can kiss my eyes and that's just the way
It's going to be, you know, and so, I mean, listen man, respect is given this man is one of the greatest ever D Wade. As a Hall of Famer, who I love dearly Kobe. And Chris, Paul, like I said, scared the living hell out of me because when they picked, when they had a problem is what I said was so respected about them.
The others.
Approach me when they saw me. Hmm. No, no CP3 Colby. They look for me. Pick up, you
goddamn. I know you. I know you did. Not just hear you say that shit. You just call me, you know, that's after I didn't answer their call so they called me one time. I was on a pick up the phone. Motherfucker, don't try to hide, get your ass on that phone right now. Call me back, that's some bullshit. You just said you're not like
Did you call him back? You know. Of course I did and then how'd it go from there. There's no, there's no athlete that I've ever avoided. No, no coach, no executive nothing. It's my responsibility. Within the chair that I sit in
to embrace anybody who reaches out to me. I'll kill who
it is. I don't care if you hate me, if you call me I have to call you back. If I talked about you because I made you news and so I don't have the luxury of being able to run from anybody. So I never think about running through other analysts do is that like a common thing? I want to say it's common but I
don't know what.
The tactics or techniques are because I don't pay attention to them. They are who they are.
I'm Steven that you're very in your lane man. It's awesome to like, hear how you speak and stuff. I want the honest speaking, like I'm not doctor funny robot. Like any like, it's his business and everything. But I wanted to know, do you ever regret like past takes that you've liked had on certain
athlete? Quite sure? You know. Listen, man, I didn't like that. Randy has got fired and I felt that Big Dog Robinson. Did it wrong?
When he was with the 76ers
but how high I how
I handled. That story was immature. It boarded on unprofessional at one point. It was no cause for it whatsoever. And ultimately I'm the one sitting in my chair, not Big Dog Robinson and it was my responsibility to conduct myself more professionally. I wasn't unprofessional. But that doesn't mean I could not have been better, and then I never forget, I was in Houston and I saw his son.
And I walked right up to his son and I told the Sun that situation with me and your dad, that's my fault. Not your dad, your dad didn't do anything wrong. It doesn't matter how I felt it. Doesn't matter what legitimate argument. I can get I wanted to hold no responsibility whatsoever for our son to be in the league. Potentially worrying about how I was going to cover him.
Because of whatever feelings he thought I may have had about his father based off of what I expressed. I said nah the hell with all of that it don't matter how I felt about what I thought, big rent, big dog did at the end of the day, I'm wrong. It's my responsibility. And I'm not going to add this kid walking around here thinking that I feel that way about his dad. So I walked up to my leg, I was wrong, and if I see your father, I'll tell him to his face. I was wrong and we ain't gonna do that no more. I said, whatever beef we had.
Josh is is done, you know, that was one incident, you know, you sit up there and you take a multitude of takes Allen Iverson when he and I didn't speak it. Got so ugly in 2010 that I was told there was people looking for me to do me harm, really because of of how bad it appeared with me and Ai. And well you know, he's from
The streets. I'm from the streets. So from Queens went down to Atlanta. We're I had a crew and I went down there looking for no police involved know anything. But I'm like, you looking for me, you gonna find me. I'm not going to be that kind running and I ain't living my life in hiding, that's not happening. And so he met up with me. It was a complete lie. There was nobody looking for me. There was nothing like that going on. He just didn't have anything to say. And when we sat down, finally,
It almost broke my heart because I've always had a lot of love for him because we've always been tight, but, you know, he got into some situations and you can't just ignore every damn story. When you're a journalist, you got a job to do. And I think what really resonated with me was that he looked me dead in my face and all of these stories that was percolating. He said, I don't give a shit about none of those stories, you know me. I don't care about that. All I care about
Is that your name is on the bottom line?
So to him, it wasn't the story. It was the fact that it was me. Let somebody else write it, let somebody else say that shit. Now you, because you my man, and so we ultimately reach to understanding because there's so much stuff that I had left out and then time and I didn't think that what I wrote was harmful in any way.
But when I looked at him, it didn't mean anything to him. All he cares about is that? It was me. He said, not you not you you my man and I was like, Dad is the day that I knew that I could never cover him again because I love him so much. He's like a little brother to me and that was the day. I said, I got it. And from that point forward, I have nothing to say about him. Unless I talk to him first because objectivity is out the window. I mean, we are like this.
This, that's my man. We talked about three times a month, you know, I'm always checking up on them. When I go down and Caroline, I go see him, I go check on them, the whole bit. That's my man, you know? And so I know things about him that he would never ever, ever tell any report on this Earth. That's my guy. And so because of that, you recognize that that line has been crossed. I'm not going to be objective when it comes to him. That's a so that's that's what I said.
Weighs
90 have some personal relationships that you've had with like other athletes. Does that affect the way you report on them?
Know, this was the only time that's happened because I think that he was a guy that was in a real situation that required more. See what the other, dudes? It's like, that's strictly Sports. Yeah, you know, it's like, I mean, don't get me wrong Colby and I would tie Kobe. And I had conversations after Eagle County Colorado, that has never been repeated and never will be repeated, but I will tell you
You, he died. Proclaiming his innocence. I would tell you that but I will tell you also that, you know, at the end of the day, most conversations and most relationships I have with these dudes, you know are about basketball. I would tell you me and Shaq that's different. You know, when we talk about the Iverson relationship that I have, well, I had a relationship like that to a lesser degree with Colby and I have a relationship. Damn, now identical to that with Shaq. So, you know, outside of that, you know, even though I have relationships,
A lot of people, they understand you play like, shit. I'm going to call it. Yeah, play great. I'm going to call it. I'm not gonna lie to my viewers or listeners and it's not anything for me, not to violate the code of not revealing personal stuff because I don't do that. Anyway, that's not my style. Stay out of the police blotters, don't make your personal life public consumption because police got involved or anything like that. Don't break no laws outside of that. What you doing with your life.
Life is none of my business, and that's how I've always approached it. That way, that's how understanding. So, when you do stuff professionally, I'm gonna call it exactly. Like, I see it, no mercy. Yeah, it is. What it is.
Can we switch up to the NFL? Sure? Do. What do you think today? We got Eagles Niners. This happy I was in a bingo. Let's get your picks. Its, yeah. I picked angles of the Biggles. That's he picked. Yeah, how are you this? What's your logic behind taking jobber over patch my home? Well, other effects.
All
set of my that the rats times they faced one another. What about I mean it seems to the favorite so
well / pageant Mahomes got that high ankle sprain even though they said he'll be ready to go, the fact of the matter is, he's coming into this game less than 100%. He does not have Tyreke Hill available to him. When he did have Tyree kill available last year, they lost could they winch or they could win? But I think that when you see Cincinnati fully loaded 77 their defense, their defense is their defenses, are is better this year.
Year than it was last year. And I think that Kansas City is big-time as they are and Travis Kelce. He's my brother from another mother as my dog right there. I just think that it's one of those situations where Cincinnati should be the favorite either team could win. San Francisco. Could be Philly and Mahomes and Kansas City can beat the Bengals, but I just have a feeling this going to be Philly Cincy.
You think there's anything with the NFL like with Brock /? T. He was last pic right? He's crushing it and he parallel.
Tom Brady kind of going out and then you have this kid who's, you know, no one
expected parallel is that he has everything around them because when Tom Brady first arrived in New England they had an elite defense. Yeah they had exceptional coaching by Bill Belichick and so when you have that along with a bunch of experience Savvy veterans who know how to win that goes a long way and that's what the New England Patriots have. In this case we're pretty you got an elite defense this, ranked number one across the board or offensively. You got Debo, you got kiddos, who got Christian McCaffrey, who you acquired from-from Carolina. So you have do
Dudes that you can dip and dunk the ball to it's not like you went out and you acquired Randy Moss to somebody. You acquired dudes that you can literally throw a screen pass to move the hell out the way and they can move the chains for you because that's what Debo and Christian bring to the table with that offensive line. And with the Arsenal that they have along with the play calling Brilliance of col Shannon. So I think that even though Purdy is good, the reality is is that he's been exceptionally helped by the team that he's been placed in.
Around himself and I think that's why I goes a long way. Hmm.
Soon as I would really love to know how like you grew up like Queens. I know you're from Queens and I know like the whole analyst stuff you did. Like, when did you slyke start realizing man. It's like my passion. Like,
just, I would love to know more like well, I was in I was in seventh grade and my teacher was like, you know, me get left back and forth. Grade with a first grade reading level having
You know, some issues with my academics because I had to selects undiagnosed dyslexia. I struggled, and struggled and struggled. And I definitely struggled with confidence and told, seventh grade. When my professor told my mother, he's pretty damn smart. His issue is that he drifts? If he's bored and he's disinterested, he doesn't hear anything you're saying it. Goes in one ear and out the other. He doesn't even have recall, but if he's passionate about it,
She said he said you've got somebody special on your hand because he's pretty brilliant. And so I started thinking about what was I passionate about and sports was it because of the sports that I used to watch with my dad and so because of that it just took off from there and that's where my passion started to grow because it wasn't just about sports, it built my confidence about life. The fact that I could watch and have the recall that I have and the read and comprehend what was going on in the sports world.
I will now recognize that I wasn't as dumb as I thought that I was, and as a result, my confidence built from there. So, instead of just limiting myself to sports, I would read news current events politics, all of this other stuff, you're interested. I would really, I would really expand my interest and my intellect grew. And as my intellect degruy obviously showed in my confidence and that's where it really, really came from. And so, but I also remember that.
When I'm not that passionate about something I drift and so because of that, that made me more cognizant and mindful of being around people and embracing subject matter that interest me. So I you know the best thing that the best way that I can explain it to you is that when I knew that my what do you call it? A disability malady whatever the whatever way you want to call it when I realized
That it worked to my advantage was when I became a beat writer covering the NBA because twenty thousand nineteen to twenty thousand, people would be in attendance. And I swear to y'all when deadline approached and it was time to get it done to get my article in on time, I literally didn't hear anything. I literally would be in an arena and it's 19,000 people in there and I did not hear a word.
I could I just don't know how to explain it and that's not always a good thing. You know I'm saying? You got a lady you know, you would be wise for you to listen board. Yeah, Bobby the listen, I know how to people is, I mean I'm sitting there, you know, I mean it gets to the point where you have people family, friends, loved ones, whatever. Literally. If a sporting event is on, they'll have to walk in front of the TV
block it. So I can hear because I
Don't hear Dan word, that's in like like I'm like yeah, you know what, especially, you know, my girl be like, what did I say? I'm like shit. So I mean, you know, I mean, it's stuff like that so so, you know, you definitely got that going on that, but that has always always always been me. And so, you know, I understand that and, you know, that basically answers your question about my passion and why, and where it comes from be, from the streets of New York, Hollis, Queens grew up.
Poor surrounded by drugs drug, dealers about that.
I'll talk about that in the book, just I do
and I'm very, very grateful, you know, my book, straight shooter. You know, I've been blessed and fortunate in New York Times bestseller week one. I'm very proud of that, but I got to tell you I'm thankful for to I don't I don't get here. If it wasn't for those people, that's one of the things that's influenced me with sports and just the mentality that we just finished talking about when I talk about how
You know, I'm not snitching, I'm not talking, I'm not getting in the people personal business, or whatever. I grew up with that coat. I grew up with that coat, you know, one of the biggest drug dealers in Hollis, literally lived directly across the street from me, you know, and he was a killer and it was understood Steve is not to be touched, you got to deal is in Hollis. Steve is not to be touched, you know, they understood that
It was a potential in me and they literally threatened. They were gonna whip my ass if they ever saw me on the road involved in the drug game. Anyway, they say we didn't have a choice. How did they know how did they know that about you? They would see me on the basketball court. First of all, the level of diligence that I put forth that died, shoot like 300, J's a day and stuff like that. They'd see me in school, you know. They know I came on, my do my homework, put in the work, whatever, they knew that I wasn't trying to be about that life. And so, their whole mentality was, you know,
You got your mother. There you got your four older sisters, their active part of your life. You gotta support system. You don't have to do this. We did. We made our choice, but we ain't gonna let you make this choice. And literally, I've had several of them told me. Well, we will fuck you up. Do not be on this corner. Do not be doing this. Do not care about you. Well, it's your
ass and they meant it and
I knew they meant it and so they would sit up there. They let me shoot stuff like that. Get doc, they had to get into their game. They said, all right.
For you to go, you know, but it was understood people in the neighborhood. It was widely known, do not touch me with that game. So everyone's kind of believed in you. When you were growing up, I wouldn't say everybody but but, but not certainly. Not my father, which was in the book. He didn't hear the enemy really. He didn't believe in me at all. Sorry about that. Yeah. Well, he just said you just when I got left back and forth, great, he told my mother to boy, just think smart, give it up. You can do anything with his life. So what he told her, he didn't know that I overheard him, because I was sitting on the back, porch, with the window open, but I heard him say that and
It was devastating to hear your own father, give up on you like that. But I was lucky to have cats in the neighborhood Who felt otherwise. So, you know, and then I have my older sister Linda who taught me how to read a friend of the family name, tiffer. He taught me how to read as well and it was a constant daily due diligence put forth that I was going to overcome this. And I later learned that it was dyslexia that I was suffering from, but I don't know how my sister and him overcame that this function for me. But they were
Is on it and they made me practice, practice, practice, and I would read in any word that I did. Not understand. I would grab a dictionary. I would look up the word and I would read the word. See? Its definition study the context in which it was used and I still do that to this very. Did it motivate you like after everything that he'll you? Because you know your man, especially a black man, it's hard, you know you you feel like you're born with two strikes against you? That's how you feel.
And you feel like the challenges that you have to face, you got to find some way to overcome most instances. It's not going down like that. And so, because of it, it's real easy to give up to feel like the world to Stacked against you is just that, you know, as black people. You know, we just have an incredible intestinal fortitude, no matter what obstacles, come our way. Most of us are like, damn it. We going to overcome it. We ain't bound. We ain't break. And we ain't been here we come. All right. We'll figure it out along the way. And so
That's definitely the case. That was the case with me but I was helped because I have brothers on the wrong side of the tracks who refused to allow me and I for you to be a part of that they were watching my back. They were looking out for me and they were holding me accountable, you know? And so I never like to fight for example and stuff like that. And then you know, you had cats in the neighborhood. You want to try me but knew they couldn't kill me and stuff like that because the other dudes would take them out, but they also made me fight to do they like, you ain't gonna be no damn Punk. So that
All of a sudden you're right I have to worry about this dude shooting me. So all of a sudden I can get on ten. I could beat his ass. Yeah yeah the grid system would do what I got to do. So I mean it's just all types of stuff like that that you have to deal with growing up. Why did those certain guys want to test you? Oh because I can ball and I talk shit,
ha ha. Well we are playing on the blacktop. Yeah. So you know, get on the court and it's like okay here we go. You know, you think you could take me, let me show you and I was the worst
kind because I had a Jay
So because of that, you know, you had cats and, you know, they might have been a little bit bigger, whatever they want to get physical with you. I just a 20 feet away from the basket and drill
them. Soon, as I give you the ball, it's like I'm sure in it and he's like, what level did you play by play
division two, but I really didn't play because I cracked my kneecap and half the minute I got there. So I never really, really had an opportunity to shine, which is why it makes me laugh. When people say he didn't do anything in college, you know, your average two points again. What I said, really two points. That's a lie because I never played because I cracked my kneecapping that I saw
in the photo.
Let's say, let's say, let's say you didn't get injured. Where do you what do you think would happen with your career?
I don't think I would have been Pro. I don't think I was that good but I think that has so long. I don't think I would have been pro at all, but I do believe I knew I could ball and I thought that I would have excelled at the division, two level division. One level, I was like 59, 130 pounds today to push me around. I would have been a defensive liability that would have had to coach pulling me off the bench to shoot, but not much else. So I can't say that my numbers would have been great. I just know that if I was on the court, you will have known. I would
I could Ball. But again, physicality did matter, would you have been better than Kwame Brown?
Now, I'm not going to disrespect the call me brown like
that. Don't worry about
school is cool, Kwame Brown listen, I'm very
guarded.
And what I say about him, because I've seen, yeah, his videos true. And clearly is real real personal with him. It was never personal with me. I just looked at this game and called it, like, I saw it. Now, if you remember, you got these Infamous videos of me going
off, guys. I'm serious, man. Ya know it. But guys, I can't wait a minute, wait a
minute fellas. That was 14 15 years ago. I know I'm saying.
I didn't know that this Society was going to evolve to a point where we have 14 15 years later. You got getting ready? Yeah. Let's face it. He doing interviews talking about how scarred he is because and blaming me for labeling and yeah.
If you're ready, no, you actually are not. He he was on the pivot here with my boys, Ryan Clark, and crowded until, and he's like, you know, he told
about endorsement deals and I cost about like, what? Like,
nah.
Didn't do that. They were saying this about you years before I have open my mouth. Yeah. But but it's it. But when you at the top of the Heap, which I am at this particular moment of time
doing what I do for first
take people are going to label it like that because first takes been number one for 11 years. Yeah, why does that beef? I mean you can't squash that beef. No. I mean, I'm not trying to squash. I'm not trying to start know squash anything. I got a job to do. If I knew it was going to be like that, I wouldn't have done it like that but I did say what I meant at the time.
I meant to shit. Okay yeah you're so you're so and so it's like I'm not trying to hurt him, I mean I cement look here's how I view it all. I
wish him nothing but the best I hope he is family, everybody good. He lives his life and if I knew it was going to be like this, how I did never done it, fair enough, I'm correction. But I will tell you
this, my job is to call the game of
basketball.
How I see
it called Sports, how I see it. Okay, yeah, he is not the first person that I've criticized, he won't be the last. I've been criticized, you got a whole bunch of people out here doing debate shows podcast, solo shows all the people ain't say shit about them. You coming to me, why? Okay, whatever reason is your reason that's cool but all I'm doing is talking about what I see now.
If you seven feet, and you averaging three points. Again, that's what you did. If you average of 23, that's what you did. If you a virgin 30, that's what you did. If you did, it's Rob. And you was a defensive age, that's what you did. I mean, I'm not throwing shade on anybody. I'm not trying to harm anybody. I'm not trying. I'm just doing my job. Calling it like, I see it. That's what I do. And here's the biggest thing that I get tired of
people,
Not understanding and I mean this and this is to y'all too. Even though I don't know y'all, I
want y'all to understand everybody has this obligation, okay, we cover Sports, everyone can't play it, that's 450 jobs people, they 450 million
If you want to be in the NBA, you got is 450 spots. Okay. Anybody that's mediocre is taken up the spot somebody else. So it's our job to say that might not cut it. You might need something else.
Because that's what we do. The great ones. We don't say that about them. You know what we do? We compare to integrate. Once, why would we say anything? Think about it. You got people who call people like myself and others LeBron hater. I ain't got a - bone in my body. For the brawn. He's phenomenal as a role model as a player as a person, the whole bit to me, he just ain't MJ.
okay, now the society that we are living in,
We all have to make a contribution towards stopping this bullshit. Yeah I agree. But how is it that we being negative? Because we saying you you number two, there's busy having a million there have been tens of thousands of players in NBA history. Yeah, I have you number two all-time that's just how is that hate? And yeah. Okay. How is that disrespect? We got a great. We got to stop passing to hold that baby because you have people who get their podcast.
Bill radio shows how did television shows. And because you want to feed the beast, you feed into that bullshit. Well guess what? You ain't special, if you doing that because you scared to go against the status quo, you can't be caught up in all of that. That's not hate. Yeah, that is not hate. You sit, you're talking about, I got you. Number two, all-time that is not hate, and you got people that will want to act like that. Rihanna, and Beyonce. I'm in this bullshit last. Oh yeah, so with that.
Yeah. Yeah, you kidding me. I'm like want to know about that. Yeah. But why did you say she's my fiancee? Why Sherri Shepherd
staff, came up to me. I'm on the show promoting the book. They came up to me before the show.
We would like a debate style for me,
we would like to debate style format,
so keep that in mind whenever Sherry ask you. So they're trying to make
They're trying to get good ratings off it. Well, come on, bro. At the Bates House for. Are you trying to get good ratings by having you in this? Of course. So it does nothing. But what I'm saying, I just say this is what I'm trying to say is this to you the point that I'm making is that we're all we're all doing it, there's nothing wrong with her saying we she didn't I didn't know what she was going to ask, but she was just saying, we want the debate feel? Yeah, yeah. So I went out there understanding she wanted a debate. Feel I'm looking at Rihanna, I'm like,
Well, she got my money.
I bought our albums.
I'm a fan of Ariana. She's fantastic. Because he's fantastic, right?
But there's only one
Beyonce, haha. Okay, I had no idea. I had now. People understand this.
I expect
people to disagree,
what I don't expect is, oh my God. ESPN's got
to address the story of Steven. You've got
to apologize, all Steven. I'm like what? Why? Because I said, I prefer Michael Jackson over Prince. Where were y'all? I used to like, Luther over Teddy Pendergrass. Where were y'all? I'm sorry.
I love me some knee, along some Sanaa Lathan and all these people, but damn it. I got a source mommy Mega good. Is it a cry? I'm like, what are we talking about here? Now, if I sat up there and I said, oh, I can't stand against each. Can't ask you to do. That's different. I set up the instead. Yo, yo, I love her. She's great. She got my money. I've purchased her album. I have the bill, I have the receipt. What are you talking about? Of course, I like it's just that
Beyonce. I think that Bruno Mars is the closest thing to Michael Jackson and prince in the modern era. Sure. Okay. Does. That does not mean, I don't like, I think that Jay Z is the greatest, but I grew up love. I grew up around to your seat. Hmm LL. Okay. Kool Moe Dee KRS one Eric being Rock him. I grew up with these. I grew up listening to these people and Run DMC. I know personally.
Well I know personally I grew up Jim ice today was my late brother's best friend. God Rest his soul, I'm talking about like but Nas I love nachos Eminem but Jay-Z is Jay-Z to me sure that's all crime now. But what's what's scarier? Getting that text from Kobe saying, answer your phone motherfucker if Rihanna texted you and said yo answer phones
No, hell no because I did nothing wrong. Would you answer and said, Rihanna only reason I apologize to Rihanna's because she didn't ask to be a part of this
nonsense and it's nonsense.
So I feel bad that her name was associated with nonsense. I did not know, but don't get me wrong. I don't believe I did anything wrong. And to me, this is
I
say this to people, you
know, LeBron going to miss him. Steph Curry. You going to miss them. I'm
Good news for y'all.
People keep letting this kind of bullshit happen. Y'all gon miss me. Yeah, you're gonna miss me, you're gonna miss me when im gonna be honest, and here's why I say that because this is BS. Yeah, I agree. It's like, you're trying to tell me that if I am a fan of an artist and I said, Nary an insulting word about other artists that I am pitting two women against each other. I'm hurting. I'm hurting
This. Why does it have to be? I'm like, really, that's what we doing now. Your I'm telling y'all trust me, trust me. You want to listen to me when I say this podcasters radio, host television pundit. Saw listen, you got to stop this BS. You got to stop this BS where you get to be
labeled a
hater because you big up
somebody more so than the
other. Now, if you'd being
negative about another person,
And denigrating them and insulting them. No, that's
different. That's different. But me saying, you know, I prefer Beyonce over Rihanna and I got people,
you know, sending messages
or Facebook, you better watch your back from Navy and I went like this to show you a little bit. Let me put myself on First Street. Again, this is last week. Just let me, I said, who tells me? What you mean? The Navy a Navy. Navy Army. Navy Air Force Marines when I was old. Who the hell is that?
No, to Rihanna neighbors it. Rihanna Navy. Who the hell is that? I did not know. Yeah, I had no clue. I've never heard of them until last week. Did you, did you apologize for what do you think? It's ridiculous. You have to apologize. I just told you. I apologize to Rihanna. Yeah, because of her name being associated with such nonsensical drivel, it makes no sense, but I apologize. No, damn Navy. I apologize. No, damn industry. All of them completely. Go someplace.
Yesterday. This is nonsense. Yeah, and I'm telling you right now, if y'all don't stand up and defend against this bullshit,
Y'all ain't gonna have a podcast that matters. Nobody is radio shows television. It's all going to evaporate because you can't say anything. Has it gotten tougher. That's what you think that's what people want. They want to hear, you say that shit and that's what it does for that show. It's like, it's listen. But I say what I feel, if you in case, you haven't figured that, you know that? Yeah, I say what I feel, but
If the Kwame Brown thing
that's -
I got that I own that. Yeah I had to do it over again from 14 15 years ago. Guys. I would do it differently. Okay. No question about it. All right but I did nothing wrong with the Rihanna Beyonce thing. Nothing. Okay. It's Petty, is ridiculous and I have any time you think. Do you think feel can kind of be a detriment to your own success as well? Because like having a feel and then being logical in certain situations, you think that could be
a detriment to your own success. If it is, it is you got to accept who you are. Because at the end of the day, the only thing that sustainable is being your true authentic. Self is try to be a phony, just to get some place, is not going to have any longevity to it. It's not going to last. So you think feel is like the ultimate thing that you should always come by? I wouldn't say just yours. You got to put forth your due diligence. You got to do your homework, it has to matter P. You have that credibility, people gotta know that your place comes from a place of love hearts. Come from are such and such
That substance absorbs your kid just be talking shit just to be talking shit, you see, they could sit up the and
used my presentation and say that, but if you listen to what I say, yeah,
you'll notice that. Most things that I say, I'm spitting fat. Yeah, I heard it. I heard people, people say the most ridiculous things in the world, go viral now. Yeah, even skip. I saw skip tweeted last night. He said the bronze probably relieved. They didn't call that foul. So we didn't have to shoot free throws. Okay. But it's like, that's the biggest like that's ridiculous and he doesn't even
Believe that fair enough to you. Yeah, but I would say to you about Skip, is that it is consistent
with who he is, when it comes to
LeBron, so whether intentional or not, he's on brand for sure, that's who he is. When it comes to LeBron, I happen to disagree. I happened to have disagreed, many, many years with him about that, but he is consistent. Because you feel that way though, I'm think that he actually genuinely
Was that way?
Yes, because I'm because because because he like many others are people who gravitate to a certain error and certain players you grab and a tortoise and
the thought of somebody
eclipsing them infuriates, you
me, I don't care. You don't give, I just feel what I feel. It's not a desire to hold on
to some time that
the only thing that I want to hold onto as it.
Retains to the past. I like the path to prosperity to be consistent but can't I don't like it to be altered but then people try to judge as if you went through that same path. Somebody from the past went through, it's just like a Hall of Famer picking up the phone and calling me and saying, Stephen A, make sure you hold them accountable, does what you would do to us, put them through the same thing. You put us through, see, I like stuff like that because that's, that's people reminding me that there's a level of consistency that needs to come with the criteria.
And as long as that is tastes good, it's good, it's good, the consistent criteria, don't change it for somebody, but then judge them to say. No. Yeah. Are you going to change the criteria that you have to judge them on a sense? Yeah, I Can't Describe theory of the same and I say, this is what I'm
seeing and this is what it is. Do you
think with skip though, for him holding a grudge like not, not a grudge per se, but more of like, like the inferior stuff that you were talking about. Can't
You say that about Run DMC, Rock am the the great say you do talk about what I mean by that is like even like the Jordan LeBron debate, right? It's like damn like LeBron and I feel as if honestly speaking you talk about feel, I feel as if a lot of people are like, damn, LeBron will never Eclipse MJ, no matter what the hell he does. Well, you know, I'm trying to say except I think six NBA Finals loss. Okay. But okay, then, yeah. You could fail in life, though. Sometimes I'm like that, but it,
That place but it's not like LeBron went to 10 NBA finals and he's nine and one or 10 and 0 and people are saying this you got to just like you might feel differently, you got to take into account, the fact he's lost. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm sorry. Maybe I'm like, you know, feeling a way of like happy. It's okay. But I got to think logically
Come on, Blake. Come on Legos. No, come on. But is a bit easier to score? You're right. You're right. That you're right. I got to look at it that way. Don't you think that's why this is the that's I hate that debate, the MJ LeBron because no one's ever gonna change their mind anyway. So why don't you know what to me? I don't take it that far. Yeah, but I mean by that is that you hate it. I don't think about it.
I don't think and everybody keeps coming to me asking that question if they did ask I wouldn't sure do you think as like a in your position and your position there is any pressure like let's say you're picking the winner of the finals years and years and you get it wrong, just got it wrong. Six straight years. Do you have any? Is there any accountability for that?
You like know why should they be just someone in your position? That's not a student of the game? No, no I cover that. Don't know shit about basketball and talk about basketball everyday. What if they say I went over six, though. So maybe what about the? What about before that when I went, eight know what about you? Don't hear about that. You don't hear about that one. That's so that's, that's what I'm trying to say. So what happens is, is Young Dudes want to come up that want to recall what they want to recall. It's like the person that comes up to me
and
They says to me I could beat you in the debate, man.
That's happened to me. Do you know what? I've said to them when they said that to
me I don't you probably could.
Here's what I'd like you here's what I'd like you to do.
I'd like you to come to me after you put in the 20 years that I put in before I got a license to marry can't debate with that then
because when I was, when I wanted to get in the industry, we had the Bryant gumbel's and the
Bob Costas has the how it goes.
Sales and various others
and will burn and Kornheiser came along, and you had to Sports reporters with Lupica and Bob Ryan, and Mitch Albom,
and all these other people. And I thought I could do that in my
sleep.
I had to wait, I had to go to school. I had to get my education. I had to do three internships before I ever, even got graduated from college at the start off as an editorial, assistant, living off of tuna, fish and Kool-Aid. I had to start off as a high school reporter after that, after that, I had to do a college beat and get promoted seven
times before. I even became a columnist before, I was even on television, I had to do all of this before I ever had the license to debate. Who the fuck are
you to think that you get?
To
bypass all that stuff that I just highlighted and then come up and just debate me, you can kiss off, you have to wait. Yep.
Because that's what I had to do it if it's called the
process, that's true. What if it's MMA fan? Because I'm honestly, it doesn't like you. No, no, no with all due respect. That's not a credible question. No, it is kind of no, because there's nothing to debate because I don't care is so darn it. I don't know. All I did was, I was sitting at the MMA event minding my business.
Don't I'm sorry. This is my opinion. Like how you have a quantity but you don't really know too much by Mac. I'm sorry. I'm so sorry to say that, right? That's the truth. Tom stomach has come out. When you talking about even comedian McGregor, you talked about could be McGregor. Oh my God. 2:29, when they fight. Yeah, you know, my God, you just telling his 20 years. No, okay, no, no, no, it's not that's not 20 years going to let you finish. That's not real and then I'm going to let you. I'm going to let you finish and then after that, I'm going to show you how foolish.
Ryoko ghostly, let's go. Okay, could be McGregor, right? I just think like, you know, your basketball mind is, is very intellectual and I love the way you think, and I love the way you like, you know, critique things even when you talked about what Iran where he was coming at, you know, NFL owners and you're like, yo, be careful to have seen that the other day got you. I think you're very smart with that, but I think, when you talk about could be McGregor, it could be cowboy. And, and it
Like you're, you're not to honed in on how MMA is actually is. And and that's just one critique. I have of you like eat, like, you talk about Kwame Brown. Like, I can't talk about it. Like, you know, I mean, like, talk like Allen Iverson, all that good stuff, but what was your take on could unplug?
Like, I'd like to answer you guys. Give me a chance to answer because he, you like hear yourself talk.
I get paid to do it and you invited me here
to talk. So let me ask you a question.
I just think that, like, I still can't specifically. No, still not. Okay, I'm so sorry. I'm thinking. All right. Good good. I have several witnesses over there. Okay. I was at the MMA event, as a fan chillin with the president of the UFC and the president of endeavor. Who happens to be the man. Who hired me at ESPN in 2003. Okay, ESPN says you here, so credit,
Hurry, this is weird SPSS, you're here. Could you do us a favor? We know you don't watch the sport like that you're just learning the sport. Would you mind standing next to Daniel Cormier and them and doing the segment for us. I said if I can wear that I said, I don't know. I've never watched the make a medal. Yeah, I said I'm here. I said I'm rooting for Conor McGregor. I know kind of break a clip anybody
D. But damn. A great way to make a metaphor. The time was 26, 27? And I know I said he's gonna Maul him the devil. What, but what if Connor McGregor? What did he Clips? Mm, let me have it timeout. Let me take it a step further. So Dan you call me and goes first and he's talking. Hmm. Everybody's cracking up because I said we're gonna go with what he said and everybody's cracking up because I'm like he's ahead light heavyweight champion where he knows this, I don't, I'm here, I don't know.
Sport. I said, I love I respect the athletes. I'm a fan, I'm starting to watch it. That's all the problem with the MMA fans was that they felt and Joe Rogan said that at the time, they felt like you shouldn't be doing that unless you're an expert and I said, no, you shouldn't be doing it if you're pretending to be an expert and you're not, you know, how many times somebody goes up to an actor and actress of football player, a fan of somebody
What do you feel about this game between the Warriors and the Cavaliers or some basketball-related Madam? They were a fan in attendance, but because they're popular, they put you on the microphone in front of the camera and they asked you a question. So what I'm saying to you is your point is absolutely valid. If I ever went on there and said I am an expert, I followed this sport agency 900. Not only did I not say that? I made sure to tell people, look, I don't know. I'm just
I like this one. I like the environment. The vibe is pretty cool. Blah, blah, blah. Conor McGregor fights Cerrone cowboy Cerrone, I caught that fight accurate. That's when Joe Rogan came at me. But Nate Diaz said, Stephen, A was right. What was your take? Okay, hold on, hold on, I Cerrone. I said he looked like a deer in headlights. I said, now I don't know, quote, I don't know Ma
But I know a scared do when I see one, okay? Because I've been covering sports for all of these years and that night with those lights coming on, he was
scared. Okay. Connor.
But you I have seen throughout the years where the bigger, the stage, the brighter, the light that is what affects a particular athlete. And that night, I saw that from cowboy Cerrone.
I didn't see it from him when he was on the undercard and he beat up. I
forgot the gate to Duty beat up real
bad but I didn't see that that night when he was on the undercard iswhat, when he went into the ring against MacGregor and those lights came on and he was the main event he shrunk, that's it. So for me, it's like, I'm looking at the MMA community. And I said, tell me when I said, I was an expert. Tell me when I even said that, I want to hear your point, I'm sorry.
Me and it just I will. It
also sounds like anything you talk about, no matter what, people are going to take you as and thanks for next. And that's very very true. Which makes no. That makes sense. Yeah, you kind of signed up for that in a sense. No. No. I didn't because I'm not signing up. I'm not signing up for you, not listening. I specifically said, I don't, I'm just learning to mme. No, I don't, you know here but not that's what I meant. What I meant was. I think other people just assume though, Stephen A like we have to treat him like an expert. Well, what do you maybe so but what
Happens. Is this, I'm Steven A
and for better or worse over the you don't knock on wood. It could end tomorrow and next month, whatever. But I've been number one for 11 years. I'm box office but
don't mess. So, when I come on camera, people watch. And so they said, well, we got you here. I'm literally in the ESPN Booth eating food, chill it and do like this, could you come on camera? Don't you think that comes off from fuel as well like people could hear
Two lists like not to listen but like if someone hears its I think it's not as important as someone's listening, they want to be entertained, it's ontology towards more payment. It's entirely plausible that they said, let's hear what this crazy-ass dude got to say, because he don't cover MMA. Let's see what he says, no problem. And you've thought of that before your decision May write, like one would like, they ask you a favor, right? You're like, okay, I understand what I'm about to do right now. I'm not going to say I'm an expert.
Art. This isn't no, that's just insane. That's equivalent to what? Remember when I told you earlier conversation and what I told you early in the conversation if I'm wrong publicly
I'll apologize publicly. Of course, I won't apologize privately
because I did it on the S4 corrected on it, 100% what's the same principle? If you know that an audience is watching and they may be expecting expertise because they're listening to Daniel call me and they listening to Joe Road. Yeah of course. And all
These are the guys and I know I'm not inherently in my opinion, it's my obligation to let you know. Look man, I'll take this is no damn expert opinion. Don't go ahead and
bet on my my suggestion.
I would not do that because I don't know. But for me this is what I'm
thinking and I'll let you know,
okay? Because I can do that. That's awesome here, that's actually
really what is, what's up with the No Mercy
podcast. Um, it's went on you to January 9th. I couldn't go on
before then.
Even though it's been out since September 26th because ESPN, I had to negotiate my way out of my contract, be allowed to do all of that because they have my rights, right? And so they had to give me the right to do that. And I had to negotiate my way to do that, but I'm told is doing pretty damn well. So what does it tell? Well, it's be venturing Beyond The World of Sports, not limiting myself to the corridors of sports because doing the ESPN you know, you might have heard me. Speak thing about things, politically social justice issue stuff like that from time to time but by and large.
Is working for ESPN, you're pretty restricted to doing to being confined to the World of Sports. It was important to me that if I was going to do a podcast that I had the freedom to venture beyond that. This political issues going on, I want to talk about it. Just social justice issues. Like the recent murder of this kid, Tyree Nichols and Memphis. I want to be able to talk about that. I don't want to be, I don't want it to be something that I have to avoid. Because it's not my Lane because I'm restricted by the corridors of ESPN in that regard. That was very important to me. And so I assured them that I would
I'd do what I'm supposed to do for them on their time. But on my time does what I want to do. Mmm. And so it was something that we negotiated there was an agreement with it. They allowed me to do that after the negotiations, of course. And so that's what my no mercy podcast is all about. I touch on issues that are percolate. That's pertinent fact, you know, pop culture and entertainment, social justice issues, politics current affairs news Plus Sports. I'm not limited to anything and that
Is the kind of platform that I wanted my for myself. If I was going to do a podcast
actually weeks, maybe three times a week, how do you enjoy doing it on YouTube as compared to like the more corporate ESPN
stuff? I love it. What's these for me? They could say corporate ESPN but when it comes to the World of Sports is no better place to be than ESPN in my opinion, in my opinion. But I mean like being Your Own Boss completely like what? Not that you're at night. Yeah, well I get you. But being my own boss is a lot of responsibility and there's no doubt about it. I have a team working under me.
And so every little thing that you know you learn as you go away. I've never had to deal with this before thumbnails you got graphics and yeah, I've never had to deal with that in my life. That's stuff that I left up to everybody else. Now I got to deal with it and then I'm leaving it up to other people from time to time and they might do something that I myself. I would have done this a little bit different. I gotta make that cool. But you gotta trust you gotta know when to trust, folks know when to pull a heavy hand, no one to step back and let them do their job stuff like that. And I'm the one cutting the checks.
And so for me it's an incredible challenge, its new I get all of that and you know but all of y'all everybody that's out here doing the serves as an inspiration because it's not safe. You know the fact is you're betting on yourself and the reality is that when you're in Corporate America and you're getting a salary every day, whether it's weekly, bimonthly or whatever, the case may be, although you still putting forth your effort, you're still not betting on yourself to the degree that you are when you're out on your own, that's your employing people.
People. And that's what I'm doing now. That's new to me because I've never done that before, and it's an incredible challenge, but props to y'all, to be Sooyoung, to do what you do to run your own shop. A lot of people, you'd be surprised how a lot of old school folks like myself have been highly reluctant in hesitant over the years to do that because throughout history, you never really were taught that. That is the that is the safe way to go. Usually one in 1,000 people succeed as opposed to one in 50 for
When you talking about Corporate America, you think we're feeding them
though. Well, like the, the one question I've always liked wanted to know is like we're putting out things on YouTube and just feeding the people that are on YouTube that like doesn't that kind of fact the way we're trying to like,
like have like, you know,
quote unquote like free speech, you know I mean being able to say what you want, I think feeding YouTube and doing all those things not to talk about are not because I know it's going to be
On YouTube. I think it's a great. Well, conversation have. Let me say this to you. How old are you 28? How do you
2828? You 21:21? Yeah.
My advice to y'all would be this, you know as much success as I've had one of the greatest things that I'm starting to feel right now. I'm 55. You know I mean
one more good contract, I'm straight. Yeah. Yeah. I'm saying it was
nice. Ride was cool, you know. I'm
okay, great to see you. I feel God I
still feel like I got 15, 20 years.
And me. But what I'm saying to you was that conceivably you got people in this day and age retiring at the age of 62. Yeah,
for me
I will have achieved the ultimate goal is if at the age of 62 I can literally say I'm walking away from everything and I'm just going to show that has seven past should have that seven years. Yes. Seven years
from now.
All eat, both of
y'all. Got over 30. You got 40. I gotta tell you what I would tell you is this be very, very careful because the good side is that you young. The world is your oyster. You Got the Whole World in front of you. Go for, do what you got to do.
The bad part about it, understand the society that we're living in right now. One mistake could cost you everything fine and they can Define you crap. And so, it's incredible. It's incredibly important to be mindful of The Importance of Being substantive,
being the kind of
person that
will even if people disagree with
you, they're able to look at you. The able to say you was fair-minded strong, you were humane
You know, and you will as thorough as you possibly could be
if you're able to do those three
things, your Humane you're fair and you are as thorough as you possibly can be what you touched on was as close to the truth as you can
possibly get.
Those are the kind of things that can sustain you for years and years and years to come. So, if you weren't doing this, you could always do something else and people will be receptive to embrace
sometimes, it can set you free.
Though. I think the suit that literally, the truth can set you free. I mean, we're living in
literally exactly what's going on right now. This one, it's, it's, it's horrible the games right though. Because people, listen, man, we've seen people that will try to convince us. The sky is gray, when it's blue like we're looking at the sky. That's. Yeah. And it's not
amazing and they will try to convince you is gray. So when you say the truth, I said
get as close to the truth as you possibly can because what I'm trying to say
You is someone will always try to convoluted what you don't want it to do is put your stuff with. You don't want to do, is put yourself in a position where someone
else's truth damages, you to
such a degree
that you react, because it's either it's above or like, it's either at the top, every show you do. If you should be thinking about tomorrow,
it shouldn't be about yesterday. It shouldn't be about now, it should be about tomorrow. You have to look ahead to ensure your
one step ahead from most naysayer. Yeah, critics Skeptics Etc to to insulate yourself from the Bia.
That's that's how we treat this to. I'm you gotta, we gotta wrap it up because I had to get out of here, but we did Elon Musk. It was a huge thing for us the next day. We're already looking for the next guy, right? And even live off that, but before we let you go, I just want to ask you. If you had like one during her whole career, if you had one like, very special moment or something like that, you think was just something you'll never forget or just change your life.
Life.
Honestly speaking.
I would always ask answer that question by saying my first interview with Allen Iverson when I was doing quite frankly, my show on ESPN 2 but especially as I reflect on my book straight shooter and I think about the things about my personal life that I put in that story. And I think about where I've been blessed to be at this point in time in my life, I would have to answer that question by saying
One of the greatest moments was me with Kobe Bryant.
Kobe Bryant and I saw each other three weeks before he died. New Year's Eve, 2019 going into 2020.
Where we were as nobody's business. We were at a party of a superstar that was having a party at his house and we were there.
And people were around and they saw Russ and they were wondering what the hell was going on because even though we'd always each other and give each other pound and a hug, we kept hugging each other for like 15 minutes. We were talking and he was incredibly proud of me.
Because of what I was doing in my career and where I was going and we were talking about it because he was doing the, you know, he was doing his thing for ESPN and ESPN plus detail. And he knew that I was about to start my production company and stuff like that, and we were talking about collaborate on certain projects and stuff like that, coming forward. And we were supposed to meet a few weeks later her. Before his fatal helicopter crash,
What I remember about that night as I had never seen him that happy ever after all the years that I knew and we were talking about his happiness, he was talking about me and what I was accomplishing and what we were going to do and I was talking to him about his happiness and he said it's just a good feeling to know as much stuff that I want to do now.
That my initial list I did it all, they can't say nothing and he said for the first time in my life, I'm at peace. You know. He could go to a game with Gianna God, Rest her soul, all these hole and he could sit up there to game and there was no itch to be back on the court. There was no itch to have another championship. There was no hitch to be recognized differently or anything like that. He did it, he did it.
And he was like this is what life is all about. When you achieve what you set out to achieve and you know that you left nothing on the table.
And when you have that, that is when you are at peace, it doesn't come before then and he was very, very good and very big on making sure that his story was relatable to everyone in life. He's talking about you guys, he's talking about me, he's talking about Solange, he's talking about everybody, he's talking about whatever it is, that's inside of you. That does
it for you,
that's what you're supposed to.
Going after he was wise enough to do it and pull it off. And the misery that other people feel is because they know as I remember this past the t.d. Jakes, once said he said, you can lock a tiger or a lion can be born into captivity and they only know one way he said, but why is the cage encasing them?
He said, because there's something in them that says, there's something out there. There's something more out there and with Colby, he was like, yeah, I knew there was something out there and I went and got it.
and,
If every said I want more now. But if everything ended now,
I did it. I got my family, I got my kids and I got all these accomplishments and there's nothing that anybody could say and I'll never forget that. As long as I live how much at peace he was with his life. He was, he was like 40, 40, going 41 years old and I had never seen anyone his age including myself happier.
That he was that night with his life and that's what I hold onto. And that's the kind of thing that, you know, I put it in my book when I got covid and I start reflecting on my life and looking back at things I'm like, damn, you know. Yeah, I'm hungry. You know, now, two books on the bestseller list. Okay. I did it. I did what I came to do. So yeah, I'ma be on ESPN. You don't see me off?
First Take you'll see million. Be a countdown going to hear me on. No mercy on my podcast. You don't see my books on shelves. You don't see all of that. But you know something
I did it. And so now I can look at my bodyguard, my assistant, my sister, my brother-in-law, and my other sisters, my nieces, and nephews my daughter's everything. And I'm like,
I'm all right,
I'm okay. And that, that's what I was thinking about Kobe this week when he crossed my mind. The anniversary of his death is Third Year Anniversary. I was thinking about this, all wrong, that's the first time that's the first time I looked at myself,
And in the way that he looked at himself and he was talking about to me that night. Yeah. And that's what I got for
a powerful. Thanks for sharing your tender. You tend to Aaron's game, you tend to forget where you're really like, what you've accomplished getting? That's that's what I got from. Like we were saying, yeah, as you got to get, it's great to hear because like even hearing that story. It's like like damn. You know what I mean? God Rest his soul for real like honestly. Yeah, I'm like it for real. It's the greatest thing ever. Like, even where you're saying,
With fuck man. I'm good. You know I mean like when you get to a point or what it's just it's awesome here that it's alright. Your persistence Tanya. So you got to get out of here but we appreciate your thank you. See you man crazy.
