I am the man sick with the slaves taking of destined for fame. What's up, ladies and gentlemen boys and girls around the world. I would like to welcome you back to the real talk with zubi podcast now on today's episode, of course, we've got on a special guest. This is Max Keiser he is
A Bitcoin Pioneer. He has been creating content in the Bitcoin space for about a decade. He is a Bitcoin. Oh gee, he is also an investor an entrepreneur a broadcaster and an all-around very interesting guy. Welcome to the show Max. How you doing the
zimmi? It's great to be with you like wise man. So I've
done a brief intro right there, but for people who may not be familiar with who you are. Tell them a little bit about yourself next.
Well, I
Started in 1982 on Wall Street as a stockbroker. That was my first job out of school. Did that for eight years? Then I went into semi-retirement and Paris for five years. Then I came back to Los Angeles that started the Hollywood Stock Exchange. I got a patent on a virtual currency patent number 59550 176 the first patent awarded for a digital currency, then I sold that company to Cantor Fitzgerald on Wall Street.
Back to France went back into semi-retirement. Then I met Stacy in the south of France and we started doing content. She had a background with the BBC and in also Hollywood doing script script doctoring some producing and we started doing content and then really by accident we got commissioned to make a film for Al Jazeera English in 2005. I think it was or 2006 and we ended up
making a series of documentary films for Al Jazeera English. It will ring in Paris at the time and we started doing content for international broadcasters. Basically we continue to do that and we started doing Keiser report on our to RT and 2009. We started covering Bitcoin in 2011 when it was a dollar and it was for me. It was a continuation of what I had been doing on Wall Street and with the Hollywood Stock Exchange, so I really got into it quickly.
And then we've been covering it now for 10 years. We've had most of the major players in the space have been on Keiser report. I would say we were pretty much the only ones giving it coverage for I would say the first five years or so. He didn't really get any coverage anywhere else and then and now we're in 20 2011 and it's exciting times
Well twenty twenty one
twenty Twenty-One and it's exciting times. Very exciting.
As let you in the system.
So how did you first how did you first discover Bitcoin? How did you even come across
it? Well Stacy booked on two Keiser report an interview with John Martinez who is into Bitcoin heavily in 2011. He invented hashcash. Okay. Oh, hush, hush. My excuse me, which was an encrypted email service and then he got into Bitcoin. He came on and he talked about on the show. And so we just jumped on it right away realizing that it was I saw it right away is
this is going to change as a new asset class effectively. So that that has a lot of implications and and then Stacey was really intrigued by all the feedback we got which was highly negative. I mean it triggered people in the audience are like, why are you doing this? That's just terrible it's going and so we thought you know, if it triggers people like this so wildly, you know, we should dig into a more and find out what's what's that the root cause of all this. Okay, so we had on
Folks in the early days from the cypherpunks and the Durley developers early core developers and you know, really I would say we kind of expose the world to Bitcoin in 2011. We put her on the map globally speaking because the show goes out to a hundred countries Millions tens of millions of viewers and there are you know, thousands of thousands of Bitcoin millionaires today that because of Keiser report. We're buying Bitcoin when it was under five.
Bucks.
Oh man. So for anyone listening to this right now, I mean if you've been checking the price of Bitcoin, you'll see that it's a blown past fifty thousand dollars just in the past couple weeks and I think today's probably hovering hovering somewhere around to the fifty thousand dollar Mark. So that's a 50,000 x appreciation from a dollar and from when it started. I don't even know probably millions of percent. So what's that Journey been like for you? I mean, I got it.
To Bitcoin in 2017, but I'd heard about it a couple years before but I didn't really do much research. I didn't do my due diligence. I didn't see what the value proposition was. It wasn't until 2017 that I really looked into it properly and got involved with it. So what's been that Journey like how what's that Journey been like over the past decade being someone who was just there so early.
Well, we have three crashes and the three having so we've had some
the first typing in 2012 and we have we've had three 90% crashes and the first one was from 30 bucks down to a dollar then we had a thousand down to the to 50 range and then 20,000 down to 3,500. Well, you know, and so those those are really tough to go through and you know, it's we had in 2017 the block size Wars which was very significant.
Piece of History where you had the hard forks and Bitcoin cash and Bitcoin Satoshi Vision came around and it was really then that it was proven that the miners don't really control the network. It's really the nodes that control the network and this is when Michael sailor actually had gotten into Bitcoin a 2013 and ignored it. He was aware of it. He kind of looked at it and ignored it. But after the block size Wars, he understood that it was a swarm of cyber Hornets, you know, he understood he started to
put the pieces together and he and then you know now he's absolutely crazy about Bitcoin and he's leading this what I call a speculative attack against the central bank's hmm and which is really a remarkable situation which we can get into but nevertheless so it's been you know fraught with all kinds of drama, you know topics down its volatile. They've got incredible personalities that come and they go some go to jail some die. You know, it's
The period when Charlie shrem was arrested at the airport and ended up going to jail was a really hard period because we were covering Bitcoin at the time and we were heavily into it and then suddenly we're like, what wait a wait a minute. Are we going to jail? What's happening here? So it was very difficult unlike today where it's you can just go to Swan Bitcoin.com forward slash aren't pill, you know, and you can get $10 free Bitcoin by just signing up and it's easy and
You know pulled right into your casa wallet immediately and have multi signature security. Right? I mean all that stuff is brand new. It's so easy today to get into Bitcoin compared to 100 before when it's typically lose it in the wrong address stolen, you know, it's just like a totally wild situation and today it's a lot easier and the numbers prove it the adoption rates are going up quite quickly. The institutional money is coming in huge and so now
We're at The Sweet Spot. If you look at it historically if I go back to the.com era of this 1990s, I as I mentioned I started the Hollywood Stock Exchange in 1996. And then in 1997, I believe it was when Netscape went public and that was really the beginning of what the.com boom era was when Netscape one public Marc Andreessen of course was Netscape and what did Marc Andreessen just do this week. He announced the public offering of coinbase.
And so this is really going to be like that 1997 moment for for Bitcoin where we go from the whole phase of is it real is it not real like we saw on the internet in the 90s to we're becomes absolutely ubiquitous and the price from here is going to go a lot lot higher.
Okay. Where do you think it's going to go?
Well for 2021 my prediction is 220,000 for coin for 2021 and longer-term the Really I say there is no top to bitcoin because there's no bottom for Fiat money. No Fiat money in history is has lasted over the past 300 years. They've all gone to zero or lost ninety-nine percent of their purchasing power. As of Altera once said all Fiat money returns to its intrinsic value of 0 and this is we're going to see this with the
US dollar the US dollars at risk of going the way of the Venezuelan Bolivar really it's turning into your garbage
gotcha. So I think I understand what you're saying that but there is going to be some people who are listening who think wow that guy's this guy's talking crazy. It's Bitcoin that's going to go to 0, how can the dollar go to 0 right? I have my trust in the dollar.
Everyone uses note Fiat money in the past 300 years has escaped going to 0 there's been hundreds of Fiat money the average life.
Span of paper money is 27 years. Okay, none of survived. The British pound is still around. Although it's no longer backed by silver or gold or anything like that. It is purely Fiat. And so we can't really say it's been around for the 300 years, but even so it's lost my over 99 percent of its purchasing power the US Dollars lost 98 to 99 percent of its purchasing power. It's a and every all these other currencies many hundreds of currencies going back 300 years of all just been
Here they've all been erased from existence. They've all gone to zero. So that's a very strong Trend and how anyone could look at that history and say well no the the dollars going to survive the dollars worth something when when it's backed by nothing except the Pentagon as Paul Krugman at the New York Times says the US Dollars back by men with guns. Well, guess what the Pentagon those guns. It costs a lot of money to keeping gassed up. You know how much it cost to keep the Pentagon?
That gassed up every day that Jets the playing the transportation the diol that all the petrochemical they spent 250 million dollars a day and oh, by the way, we do Center then to a secular bull market for Commodities oil is going up all the prices of everything going up. So the so the FED is like, oh we're going to print more going to print more. We're going to put another 10 trillion fifteen trillion 20 trillion. Well on then we're going to buy it all back and put it on our balance sheet again. We're going to monetize the debt. We're going to keep doing that. Okay. Well the
First we already see inflation breaking out in the economy right now. Yeah, people are noticing it and it's only gonna get worse. So you're going to see the next few months food and energy. It's going to be up 30 40 50 percent your wages are not going to be the are going to be flat. They're not going up there going to give more coupons, you know in the mail. I got this from today the Nielsen company, they sent me a letter and they just sent they put dollars in there. They put dishes.
Look, they just put money in there. They put two dollars in there because it's worthless coupons. It's garbage, right? It's like you're gonna I mean it's absolute
garbage. Okay. So a lot of people I'm sure look for the past decade you've been in Bitcoin way longer than I have and so you must have dealt with every criticism and type of fear and type of fud around Bitcoin, but addressing some of the some of the big ones. I mean because I think most people have heard of Bitcoin at
Stage but a lot of people don't understand how its money or why it has value or what it's backed by Etc. So can you answer a couple of those questions for people who are listening thinking well, what is bitcoin backed by you know, or Bitcoin is worthless because it's not it's not tangible or nobody uses it etcetera. So can you address some of these criticisms just so people can understand it and perhaps even compare it to Fiat money like you were doing before
well. The first question is what is my
Money, yeah, that's the first question.
So what is money?
Asking me or is that okay? So money is a unit of exchange / and store and or store a value. I would say so money doesn't have to be money isn't just numbers on a screen or dollars or pounds Etc and lots of different things can act as money in the past people have used gold people have used beads. People have used seashells. Salt Etc.
Let me stop you right there. He said
Anything can be used as money people can use anything as money. You just said that right?
Well certainly is. Yeah the mooc general as long as long as a certain group of people within that economy X is willing to accept the prize money people
anyway, and the passive use beads. You've used Stones we've goal of all been used as money. That's right. And as long as the number a lot of people use it as money, it becomes money. You just said that right?
Yep. It's based on trust within a community.
Petit
okay. So now we've got a global community of hundred million now using Bitcoin. The first of the first point is that they use it as money. Yeah, so they believe it's money. It is funny because people use it as money and and that's that's the first point in other words money is whatever people think it is. Whatever the community decides it is. That's money. We know why gold is became money over time because it has some great properties.
In that it's it's it has very no entropy. Right? I mean you can it'll it'll an ounce of gold today will remain an ounce of gold for a hundred years or 200 years. It's it's stable in the sense. It's portable. It's divisible. It's fungible, you know, it's desirable and it became money and it pushed out all the other versions of it like beads or whatever what
It's scarce gold is scarce relatively scarce. And so for five thousand years people used ultimately gold. Even the central banks that are using Fiat money. They do subtle at between them in Gold. So we understand why gold is money. It's scarce. It's portable. It's divisible is desirable and if we apply that to bitcoin, it's absolutely scarce unlike gold, which is only relatively scarce gold gold is inflating by 2 or 3% a year.
Not actually as scarce as Bitcoin, it's more divisible. It's more portable its unconscious capable, which gold doesn't have that property gold gets can get confiscated and as has been confiscated in the past in 1933 America's gold is confiscated by FDR and put it in Fort Knox. Right? So gold is confiscated. Will Bitcoin is unconscious capable. It's immutable it's indestructible and that unconscious skateable quality as I've talked to Black audiences.
Has for 10 years now is key because what's what's the problem with black America? Is that or the black community around the world is that they have their wealth confiscated over and over and over again and reason the black community has embraced Bitcoin so powerfully in America right now is because I recognize this is the first form of unconscious skateable money that's been available to them for anybody ever and so it's gaining huge Traction in the
Community as Isaiah Jackson wrote in his book Bitcoin in Black America the in quotes me in the book several times because I've been reaching out to the black community for 10 years and telling them look, you know, why T is going to be taking it all day long. It's absolutely true. You know why T is you know, it's going to be taking your shit. It happens over and over again. I'm saying the black community if all, you know, you want to keep YT out of here you put her on
Bitcoin it spun confiscated oil and I can use the W word because I'm white right back into the company word the W1 is okay for me to use because I'm white. Yeah, and I've done yet. It's necessary. It's necessary to protect so it's on confiscated. Well, that's not true gold mluc start building this you understand what's happening here. It's got all the attributes of gold. It's got bet. It's even better than gold. So then okay don't compare it to Fiat money because Fiat money is is
Just as we already discussed. It's it's a has no value at all whatsoever. It's printed without it's not has no scarcity whatsoever. They just printed by the trillions. If you look at the M1 money supply M2 M3, they literally print trillions and trillions and trillions of dollars. And as a result of this any mistake the government makes they just papered over with more paper money, right? So that's the nobody. Nobody takes the dollar seriously. No one takes
Fiat money seriously, you know, it's complete garbage. You know, it's I mean, I usually have a stack of paper money right here that I've uh, I've ripped up and thousands of dollars worth money paper money. It's it doesn't deserve any respect whatsoever. Okay. So so to get back to your query, you know, it's my we establish a money is Bitcoin fulfills the requirements of money and it's better than gold for the reasons. I just mentioned and
And so we see why this is developing the way it is. It's pushing out all that other garbage money and it's becoming the Bitcoin standard, why are people so
resistant to those ideas then because as we know the number of people, I mean 10 years in sure more and more people are adopting Bitcoin. It's market cap broke a trillion one trillion dollars last month if you're going to compare it to dollars, but we're still at a stage where
it's really early right A lot of people the vast majority of people don't own any Bitcoin vast majority of people don't really understand it. A lot of people don't trust it. A lot of people think governments are going to ban it Etc. So why do you think it's just a matter of time before people really understand this and it catches on or do something else need to happen?
Well, let me mention a couple things are so the government Banning it that's one point and then another point is people who are against it. So the people who are against it are people who are completely vested in the in the system as it is now and the status quo. So people like nouriel roubini or Peter Schiff or Paul Krugman of the New York Times or the people at Davos the people at the IMF the people at the World Bank who are wed to paper money who are wedded to the idea that
The world should be centralized that they should be there should be a politburo of authoritarian and authorities who making policy for everybody. And if you were to go against that, you know, you're a heretic and we're going to send in the Inquisition and we're going to burn you at the stake. So it's very similar to what we saw during the medieval times. For example, when Copernicus was you know, suggesting that it's not the Earth at the center, but the sun right that was a direct assault.
On the Catholic church, and the power structures of those that day and it set off what we now know to become the Renaissance and which became the Enlightenment and Bitcoin is similar in that it's totally told the center of the elites world that their money printing Fiat money central banks are not the be-all and the end-all we've got something here that pushes you out. It's the first change in base layer money in 5,000 years, so they aren't like the priests of the church were not happy about
It it when they were shown up to be charlatans the people the elites now in the US and around the world are not happy that they're being shown up to be frauds the be charlatans that their their philosophy is dead their modus operandi a is corrupt. So they're not happy about it. So we would want if Bitcoin is going to be successful. We then it would have to attract the ire of the Legacy system and the
Aryans who would be challenged by it, of course. So but one by one, they fall one by one they fall and they come over to the side of Bitcoin. We've got three sittings Congress people in Washington. Now who are actively Pro Bitcoin. We've got Cynthia. Lummis in Wyoming was a Senator who's a Bitcoin ER we've got two others in Washington who are now bit, you know, totally Pro Bitcoin America now is starting to shift to be getting more Pro Bitcoins. I don't and and
And this idea of government Banning it again completely fallacious argument instead. What we're seeing is that governments are realizing they need to embrace Bitcoin to remain competitive. So they're not going to ban it. They're going to start mining it. They're going to start hoarding it because we're having with similar to let's say a Sputnik moment when America entered the Space Race because the Soviets had put up a satellite in orbit and then America said we're going to land a man on the moon. Well now you've got a ran Russia China Kazakhstan.
And in several other countries are hoarding in mining Bitcoin and America is going to look at that and say wait a minute. Do we want Iran to be the richest country in the world? No, we've got to start Mining and hoarding Bitcoin right now. And that's got to be a hash race or a hash moment where America's got to start to get into the race here. Anybody who have bands Bitcoin is going to be left for dead Nigeria. They had a chance to become the leading Bitcoin country in the world. The government came out and said we're going to ban.
In it and the people said hey, guess what? We're going to ignore you the Bitcoin price the house seventy thousand dollars a coin. Yeah, that's what you just expose yourself as impotent fools and we don't reckon listen to you anymore drop dead. Same thing in India India saying, oh we're going to ban it. The people are saying guess what you can go pound sand. We don't we're not going to listen to you anymore. So this is a great Insurrection. It's the global Insurrection against Banker occupation. Thanks to bitcoin. We're going to get rid of the
Nation-state we're going to get rid of the Central Bank. We're going to have peer-to-peer Commerce with the hardest money ever known in the history of humans and it's pro-peace unlike Fiat money. That's pro war war and Fiat money go together the Bitcoin promotes. Peace Bitcoin promote. Can you I know
what you mean there, but can you explain what? Can you go into that more when you said that Fiat money promotes War, can you talk about that more for some people who may not understand that immediately
right make so
when you go to war it's expensive. Yes, and if you go to war and you start running out of money, you start printing more of it because you can say the war keeps going and you know, Afghanistan is a good example America's still in Afghanistan and why because they just print the money. Yeah if they had to actually pay for the war using hard money like the gold that is in the Fort Knox.
there was a war would have ended 15 years ago under the gold standard wars were somewhat Limited in duration because countries would run out of money, they'd run out of gold and the war would be over and so there was a limiting factor to it because Bitcoin is unconscious skateable and it you cannot acquire my Bitcoin through coercion or violence unlike Fiat money, you know the America
Has the u.s. Dollar standard World Reserve currency, the foreign policy is give us all of your Commodities and wealth in exchange for this in exchange for this nonsensical paper money. Yeah, or we're going to send the Marines in I'm going to start killing people like Iraq great example, we want your oil and Saddam said no, I don't think so. I'm going to price it in Euros instead America said, okay. Well we're going to kill 500,000 of your Iraqi women and children.
And and we're going to take over the country and now we own the oil. How about that buddy? And the world said? Oh bravo. Bravo. Tony Blair was like, yeah. Yeah go
get some no, it's okay America does
it? Yeah. It's pathetic now with Bitcoin. It's like you can send in as many marines as you want. Everything's in Bitcoin, so you're not going to get anything. So you're wasting your time and money wants to just stay in Washington DC and go on the web and masturbate like all you
Bureaucrats,
I mean, that's the only thing you're good for, you know do it Jeff toobin do it, but do is zoom call and masturbate. I mean that's what the week before. That's all they're good for their professional masturbators. So with with Bitcoin there like there's got nothing else to do either buy Bitcoin or shut up, right? And there's nothing you can do about it because nothing you can do about it again. I read my message to those communities in America.
Erica that have been treated poorly for hundreds of years, you know, this is unconscious capable wealth. Yeah the KKK can show up in your door and it
doesn't matter.
They're not going to get your
Bitcoin. Yeah, they
can tear your house down, but they still don't get your Bitcoin.
Yeah. Hopefully we're hopefully hopefully we're past all that as well. But
nobody got the point. The black community is still being murdered in the street for no reason other than being.
Not not by the KKK man.
They they grow up. Yeah, but why Supremacy is still the operating, you know logic of American policy. There's no doubt about that, you know retracting my friend Eureka. She will disagree
on that one man. Most black people in America are getting killed by other black people man. We know that that's a fact
that's a major major fact systemic economic disenfranchisement and
And the prison industrial complex, which is I've got a black man in jail has created enormous social problems. And that one could like in most akin to white supremacy, which is has a long long history in the United States and I hear that Brahmin away. It's not going away.
I'm not accepting that black people are killing other black people because of white supremacy.
That's not an argument. I'm going to buy but you don't need to do all that
in. The black community was orchestrated by the White Community that's leads to black-on-black violence because you're it's because essentially it's an open-air prison in all these communities, which is a very violent situation what I'm saying to the black community is like the way out is through Bitcoin because when these guys come knocking on the door, they can't get your big.
Coin so I mean, I mean we can continue down this path from my position that you've got white supremacist running America.
Nah, man, no, wait wait wait now that would be a big argument, but we will save that one for later. I'm here I'm with you I'm with you on the Bitcoin. I'm not with you on the white supremacy one. I don't rightly gonna take a look we can yeah, we should actually we should yeah, I don't think we can Outsource.
Ability of individuals actions to it's a white people all day long. It doesn't make sense and a lot of those problems exist outside of the
US have an ongoing pogrom against ethnic minority. You know, you're just going to create all kinds. Well. Well, where where pogroms come on man? Yeah.
We're absolutely where look here's the municipal. Here's the deal in America the private prisons in America. They will go into a community. I mean, it's a pallet e and they'll say Outsource our your prisons to us the private Corporation and you we can take that off your list of things that you need to do at your municipality. The only thing we ask is that you the municipality have to make sure that we're at 98 percent occupancy at our private prison. It's written in the contract. It's written
Practice. This is not I'm not making this up. It's as known facts. So that means that the police of that municipality go out and they need to fill the prison to 98 percent capacity to fulfill their contract. So they go out and the rest black man essentially and put them into prison to fulfill their own rack. And then for what arrest hang on, hang on. Hang on. Hang on.
It's a day. So they now they got slavery back in America. It's back in America slavery is back. It's legal in America. There's a real easy way to not
go to prison.
Really the way it doesn't matter your skin color. If you don't commit crime don't go to prison.
It doesn't matter. I think you're being naive because my naive I think you're all the things. I think you're taking black man
Agency. I think you're taking agency away from black people by Outsourcing all of this and blaming everything on white people black people have agency black people have responsibility. If someone goes out and murders another black person can't blame that on a white person. If someone goes out and Rob's another black person can't blame that on a white person. I know.
Millionaire and I'm connected to thousands of black Americans and if you don't commit a crime regardless of your skin color unless in very extreme are circumstances, you're not you're not ending up in prison sure. There can be problems with the prison industrial complex
the overriding they're just little that guides the justice system in the United States is based on white supremacy and that completely breaking down to every single layer down to the municipal level within that.
At in region by region, you will find differences and they're on an individual basis. Of course, there's difference difference that's going on, but we know that with for example, Isaiah Jackson my friend who wrote Bitcoin in Black America. I know it's quite specifically about the red lining that goes on the zoning the gerrymandering essentially the isolation the the way that the black community is constantly deprived of bank loans and loans and and targeted and subjected to abuse.
It's been subjected to all kinds of racism constantly. All the time is built into the system. And then this
is all you think this is a bigger problem than people's actual personal responsibility and own behaviors and
actions. Yeah, I do because it's you're living in a system of white supremacy and that has talking. Okay. Hang on. Hang on you keep saying white
supremacy. Can you please define what you mean when you say that because I know
what is white though. It's it means exactly what it is the white population believes that
It has rights above and beyond the black population that they're
naughty believe. Do you believe
that no,
okay, you think most white people in America believe
that at some level? Yes.
Okay, but you're different. Yeah.
I'm not saying you're a white supremacist, cuz I don't think you are but I don't think most men. I don't think most white Americans hold white supremacist beliefs. I don't buy that and
if you think that I need to be myself I can tell you I give you the the the 411 from from the mind of the white community that you have both subtle and overt racism Tendencies throughout the white population
and in the black population.
Perhaps
well, this is the minority population that's being subjected to the this. Oh this ideology, right? So they are the victims of this of this situation and I believe so where do people less than 5% in the US? No, it's not 13% Okay 13%
Yeah. So where do black people actually have agency in this world view? Because it sounds like you don't feel like black people really have agency in the situation.
They have agency with Bitcoin. Is that it? Yep.
Just like anybody I think
is that is that not raise that all racist
comment? It's a world-eater dresses coming all all people all people have agency with Bitcoin all people have like peoples and
only agency is with Bitcoin that's
in the United States agents in the United States. I would say that the Bitcoin provides Agency for black people. It might not be the only way or the only example, but let's see playing we have agency with Bitcoin because
You have on confiscated will wealth which is which is something that black community America's never had that but never had that they've never had that opportunity before.
Yeah. Look, I'm not disagreeing on the Bitcoin. I think you're like I said, I think my problem is with what you're saying is you're removing the agency that black people have black people have just as much agency
as well as removing them saying that is an example you think?
Around the world. This is what this is what the tract and this is goes to get back to bring this back kind of back to bitcoin is that one of the attractions of Bitcoin is this on these more philosophical points where people around the world are finding that they can transact person to person and there's no third party. There's no government. There's no intermediary. The the transaction is the settlement right? There's there's it's a bearer instrument and it fulfills the requirements of perfect money.
And Perfect Price Discovery, and so people are kind of moving beyond a fear-based hate based kind of societally imposed, you know fear that we that we comes down from the top and are moving into a new Direction and a new society. And and and that's what's attracting so many people to it and I made the point that in the United States when I've been talking to the black community directly for 10 years. Now. What I've said is that you know this
The first unconscious cable money ever and it for for the black community. This is a great way to whatever agency they may or may not have to improve upon it because whatever the wealth that you're aggregating and making can be put on this in on Compass cable immutable Ledger called Bitcoin and it cannot be taken from you and that is that is a phenomenally new thing that's going
To really and I see it now in the black community. If you go to club house right now, you've got the black Bitcoin billionaire group and several others African American or black American groups and they're like, yeah, you know this they really are talking about Bitcoin in such a positive way and a loving way which is fantastic. And and and that's what I'm seeing. That's what I'm observing and that's why Bitcoin is going to go super ballistic.
Because it has more than just the attributes of have being perfect money. It also favors love and peace over War love and peace over violence. It defines the state defunds the Central Bank. It defines all those Legacy systems that we have. Unfortunately been carrying on our backs for hundreds of years that we can just get rid of get rid of it all it's like gun. Do you know you went to the sea to make salt because why buy salt from British people in India when I
I make my own cloth and he the Empire left, you know, and here we have people are saying you know it I don't need your fake Fiat paper money. I can make my own money. I can make my own money. You take your central bank and shove it. I don't need it. I don't need it go away. Leave me alone. And that's what's happening. And so people are upset because they work at the central bank. They believe in the central bank and now their belief system has been crushed just like the British Empire got crushed.
When all the colonies basically said hey, you know, what bugger off just get out of my face and go back to Sri or Bedford. Get out. Get out of here right now. Everyone's saying that to all the central banks, they're saying Get out that's why there's this is going a lot higher a lot
higher you think that's good. Is that going to be the main? What do you think is going to be the main price driver? Do you think it's going to be people looking for a hedge against inflation or do you think it's going to come more from
institutions?
It's gonna come from bank failures and okay Panic buying. Okay. So we see every time Banks fail people are scared into hard assets and the best hard asset in the is my farm Bitcoin by huge Factor. So gold will benefit a little but people are going to go into Bitcoin because it's the fastest horse in the race as Paul Tudor Jones describes it. Okay, and and that's that's that's a huge driver of adoption Bitcoin is there's there's
Trillion, let's go out a hundred trillion dollars worth of investable assets around the world. That's just people buying stocks bonds property this type of thing as Investments. And and only one trillion of that is in Bitcoin little less than a trillion. Those people are starting to get nervous about the global institutions. You've got an era of D globalization. Now Stone longer globalization is D globalization. People are look at the UK, right you got brexit. So now you're out of the EU then Scotland wants to leave the UK and you know, people are breaking apart the u.s. You know, there's a secession
But in Texas, we want to leave the u.s. Down in Texas, they say right you've got trade between the US and China is becoming very tense, you know, a lot of the globalization that is was driven. The neoliberal model post World War Two is all breaking apart. And so that means that folks are going to start to look for Alternatives and they're a bit panic-stricken the IMF can't do anything the World Bank can't do anything. NATO can do anything. So they're like, what am I going to do with my wealth? There's a hundred trillion.
It so that one trillion dollar market cap for Bitcoin goes to five ten fifteen twenty trillion dollars in market cap it when it gets to 11 trillion dollars. It'll be bigger than gold and then it'll double and triple again after that. Wow.
And when what does the as you have two questions here. First one is what is the biggest? What's the biggest threat to bitcoin? How could this whole thing not work out. How could how could Bitcoin
fail?
And the question is not how well Bitcoin fail. The question is will Humanities survive big just a bit coin hit those inch high prices. Okay. In other words it going it's going to keep going whether humans are around or not. Bitcoin doesn't need humans Bitcoin is on a vector and it's going to keep going with or without humans.
We as is going to keep getting made you mean
it'll keep hashing blocks. Keep coming doesn't need humans. So humans.
The question is well humans survive, and that's an open question because right now there's a lot of problems and you may say, you know human extinction event and but Bitcoin will be fine though. It'll keep going.
What do you think human extinction event would look like that's a bit a disturbing. You know, I think are you talking like in the sort of next few? What sort of timeline are we talking about here?
Well, you got he got a couple
Of attack vectors, you got a couple of situations Brewing 1 1 would be the saber rattling that's going on right now between the major forces countries is pretty pretty Fierce. Right? So the the u.s. Is definitely on a collision course with China so that could in fact turn into first. You have a currency War than a trade War than a hot War so in with the US and China the first they had that currency War went on for 20 years when China came into the World Trade Organization that we went into a trade War.
You know under Trump remembers all trade trade trade. We need better deal. Okay. Now, you know, it seems like they're on the hotfoot. They're getting into more belligerent posturing with each other could end up being more of a hot War you've got for example Taiwan looks like this is becoming a danger zone. What happened what's been going on in Hong Kong obviously has been very caught the attention of folks on both sides of the Pacific and
Then you add in you've got another block of countries. You've got China Iran and Russia are now a block of countries. They've got the huge amount of incentive to drop the US dollar which they're in the process of doing. So they're going to drop the US dollar US dollar is no longer World Reserve currency. They've got a block of trade and it's a it's a mutual defense pact, right if you attack one you tack. All right, so that's potentially a hot zone right there. What's
Saudi Arabia, you know, they're running out of oil actually. So that's potentially in a Hot Zone then the entire Middle East so you've got you know, the the tensions on the geopolitical front or pretty high I would say relative to the last 50 years that I've or 60 years. I've been around. Yeah, and then on the environmental front clearly, there's huge environmental catastrophes going on in various zones and
Environmental zones around the world. So the the flooding the storms this type of thing that's causing the what I would look at is I don't necessarily listen to the debate about it. But I watch what insurance companies are doing. So insurance companies now are are no longer offering Insurance because they can't afford to do the insurance for flood insurance. For example, they're falling away at that. They're dropping out of Miami, right so might the insurance companies are saying you buy a condo in
I mean, that's great. But we're not going to ensure it. So the insurance companies are are kind of pulling out of the global Network. So if you can ensure property, you know, regardless of what you your opinion is on this debate. It doesn't matter because the insurance company is already made the decision for you. They they're out of the business. They're not they're not going to do it. So that that's obviously problematic and you've got the just enormous amount of people on the move from this
Also, as some areas go underwater, you know, there's climate migrants, right? So they're moving and master 300 just hundreds of thousands of people are now moving on the move because climate migration is a real thing so that that's certainly problematic then you know, so there's the that's why I say you could have an Extinction event and if in fact
Were to happen Bitcoin was would still be going. So the question is
not it would be useless know. What
would stop Bitcoin but what's going to save humans. That's the bigger it is the more relevant. That's right. Yeah. I don't
think I could I have my general concerns. I don't think I could testify is quite quite that much. I think my view is a little I mean would you say your view of the future then is is optimistic or pessimistic because that sounds quite a
well. I'm very happy because I think Bitcoin is going to save us but you know and
In the United States, we've had really good. I mean after World War Two we you know, we quote won that war and there was the American Century and the US has been completely protected against what other people experience in other countries around the world, you know and most people around the world are living, you know in very very very different lives many are in extreme poverty many are are absolutely having going through hellacious times, you know, the u.s. Is in an island of Tranquility really based on
The World War II and and we were the world Reserve currency is the US dollar. So essentially we were able to buy stuff from these countries in exchange for US Dollars that we just print so we get oil for money we print we get products from China for money that we print it's free, you know, the poor in America compared to let's say the poor in India, you know, it's quite a different spectrum of
poverty. It's definitely
different very the u.s. They're they're living like Jesus the poor.
In America are like, you know living like kings basically compared to worthy. You have real poverty.
Yeah, I mean in a lot of in I mean at the same time though, I mean in the past Century the poverty levels across the world have are sharply sharply decreasing. I mean my family backgrounds originally from Nigeria. So, you know, I'm familiar familiar with there and then I grew up in the Middle East myself and you know if you look at but regardless I mean based on
Stats Based on data based on observation. There are obviously some countries that are far ahead of others economically, but the ones that are behind you know, whether you're looking at China as you mentioned, I wasn't long ago that China had way more poverty than it does now or even India sure they're still a lot of poverty but it's getting better.
Right and that's why most absolute poverty number is now starting to creep up. So you had a few decades or I was going down is it ground? Yeah now starting to creep up with that
because of though City whole
uh in this past year
or because the the anti-poverty was in many ways brought to you by Fiat money and the ability to borrow China's debt load America's debt load all that debt. And by the way the world to debt the debt to GDP for planet Earth is like 300% the never the death. What does it what does that
actually mean like debt to who that's the future.
So in other words the reason why college kids have to go into
That to afford College. The reason why Health Care in America is unaffordable by most the reason why people can't afford a house is because of the debt. That's what that's what that's what it means to people right now is debt and that's only getting worse. And the interest on the debt is now becoming a factor. So the interest on the debt on America's debt is now getting close to in size to what we spend on the military. So it's getting just the interest on the debt. So yes.
So I'm wondering what would I'm this is something I've always been intrigued by and I've never really because whenever I hear that countries have X amount of debt, I've never it's one of those things that I've never totally understood because I'm always thinking wait, who's this? Who's this debt to and can they not just keep playing this game where they just keep on Printing and printing and doing whatever they're doing currently to keep sort of escaping this debt
as yeah, keep breaking a question.
One off the gold standard and we entered into a period of pure Fiat money. So no country had a currency backed by gold or anything like that. It was the first time in history. This is an experiment. Okay, we're all going to be Fiat money and all currencies are going to be back by other Fiat money. So it just goes around this huge. Daisy chain of Fiat money is backed by this VI money back by that Fiat money. So then going forward. Do you have a situation where?
The the the amount of printed money to support what is essentially a Ponzi scheme continues to escalate exponentially because the debts being run by these individual countries are not being paid back by GDP and the taxes that come with GDP. So the debt on the balance sheet of all these individual country, she keeps growing and growing and growing even in the UK now. It's
Over a hundred percent and it's that in Japan. It's almost three hundred percent. So they keep writing checks for stuff that they pay for with that by printing more and more more more money. So then what happens is the ability as long as all the banks are working together the central banks around the world then there's no obvious problem.
And what again to get back to bitcoin as Christine Lagarde at the IMF said recently Bitcoin is an escape valve. In other words with Bitcoin. Now people like Michael sale or microstrategy can look at this debt. Daisy chain that's building up around the world and he can say you know what? I know. They're telling me there's no inflation. But in fact I can see that there is inflation running at 15 to 20% a year. And if I
Use that debt and I'm thinking borrow money at less than 1% which is part of this whole debt Fandango this debt. Daisy chain is so everyone keeps rates are really really low and I buy Bitcoin I can crash I can make a ton of money. We saw something similar in 1993 with George Soros and the bank of England. He launched a speculative attack against the bank of England. He essentially booted them out of the exchange rate mechanism and made a billion dollars Stan druckenmiller was working with him at that time.
Time so now what the what Michael sailor Elon Musk and Jack Dorsey at Twitter are doing by putting Bitcoin on their balance sheet by the billions and billions is they're staying we essentially are going to we're going to they're attacking the system. They're attacking the central bank's they're attacking Fiat money. They could have borrowed that money to buy back their own stock and their their executive stock options would be up wildly and price but they said you know what actually we're going to make more money.
By attacking the system by taking your 1% money that is artificially low interest rates and we're going to buy this immutable unconscious skateable. Perfect money called Bitcoin and we're going to we're going to trigger This Global Central Bank attached Rafi. I think when the history is written of this Michael sailor and microstrategy will be cited as the shot heard round the world as the as the shot.
It started the global Insurrection against Banker occupation and we're seeing it right now. It's an Escape valve people who want to escape this nightmare of paper money are doing with Bitcoin. And now these corporate CEOs are doing it and they're doing it in billions and billions and that is growing quickly. And that's the problem with debt and that's where we're going to see the mark-to-market of this debt. That's where we're going to it's going to be revealed the negative impact of that debt because the government's will say
they have no way of diminishing that debt. They have no way of handling that debt. They can't simply ignore it. So this is a one-way bet and if you think about how much debt is out there, there are hundreds of trillions of dollars. In fact, the derivatives Market, which is another layer of fake money on top of this existing layer of fake money is worth well over a quadrillion. We're talking about a quadrillion of bad paper that's going to find its way into
I mean,
you know, that's that's a lot higher bitcoin price.
I don't even know what a Quadra quadrillion is. Like, is that
what that really? Really? Enjoy?
I can't even how much money is in the world. Like what's the value of everything in the world 300 trillion 300 trillion? Yeah. Okay interesting.
That's the the value of the assets of the world you have derivatives which are trading on top of that as
In terms of financial derivative contracts that are instruments that are used and finance and that in that layer is worth well over a quadrillion. Well the total Forex Market by the way, which is just the amount of money traded in for X, you know, yen-dollar pounds that's over last. I checked five trillion dollars a day a day and now getting back to interest rates for a second. Let's talk about another concept, which I call interest rate apartheid.
Oh, wow. Okay.
So and again with the black disenfranchisement in America.
It's done in many ways using interest rates. So Whitey like me if I've got a friend at Goldman Sachs, I can borrow money at 0% But the vast majority of folks out there and to a large degree the black population they can get any money at any percent. But if they can they're going to be charged a lot higher rates of return a lot higher interest rates 16 17 % look at credit card rates credit card.
Seventeen eighteen nineteen percent on your credit card and that hasn't changed in 10 15 years, even though interest rates as a whole have dropped down to near zero because Banks who are lending and 0% to their close friends to buy assets because the bank has assets on their books if they landed 0% to a hedge fund on Wall Street who's going to go buy a penthouse on Park Avenue the penthouse Market goes up and started the bank's assets that they have on their books. They go up and then
They use those assets as collateral to go out and do more financial games in the derivatives Market, but if you don't have assets and you go into the bank or your living on credit cards and you're borrowing money to buy groceries are charging to 18% The banks don't care about you that you know, because you don't own a house, you don't own an asset. You're not going to help them their assets go up. So they gouge you they rip you off. They steal your money. There's Whitey again stealing your money. Yeah. Why do you still in a runner? He's stealing your money.
Poor Whitey's money as well.
Yeah, definitely.
Yeah, I was going to say is that surely that's wealth and class-based. Yeah, then race-based, right? I mean after their Absolution with there'll be some correlations, but it's absolutely I don't like I don't like mechanics racial issues. It was that
blacks get ripped off more.
Yeah, maybe so yeah, maybe if I don't I don't like making things racial issues that are other issues, you know, if something is
socio-economic or some overlapping I know
there's overlap. I know
There's overlap of course, and I know that some of that dates back to historical issues. I just I'm not a big fan of / I / racializing things as you've probably noticed but in terms of in terms of what's happening in terms of the next, let's see, I don't know. How do you see the next how do you see the next sort of two to three years playing out in this regard when it comes to bitcoin when it comes to what guys like Michael sailor and Elon Musk has started have sort of set off in the past few months.
Do you think that that's going to lead to more and more CEOs and billionaires doing diving in and doing the same thing. Do you think all these trillions of dollars and pounds are being printed in the wake of this virus pandemic Etc, which is where where do you see it going and then in their short to mid-term,
I think it's going to lead to a collapse and confidence of the u.s. Dollar. Okay, which means that you've got, you know hyperinflationary expectations now,
Coming into the system
u.s. Dollar specifically or just all the large currencies. Is that go to the same for the British pound the Euro
Etc. Yeah, it goes for all Fiat money. But the u.s. Dollar is still World Reserve currency. So it has the greatest impact and it's so specifically the US dollar would would have the most to lose it's and I think it's going to undermine faith in the dollar and which means you got inflation is a real problem. You know, Michael Berry. He did The Big Short he
Been tweeting wildly about inflation saying, you know, you folks you got to wake up because this thing is about to blow once the inflation Genie comes out of the bottle. You can't get it back in because it's a wild beast. You know, I lived when I started on Wall Street 1982. It was right after Paul volcker when he was fed chairman to fight inflation. He took the short rate up or the 10-year rate up to 20% 20% because the infant to try to defeat inflation. Yeah, and now for since
80 you had a 40-year bull market in bonds because rates have gone down for 40 years. That's a secular bull market in bonds. That's lasted 40 years if that breaks and you have a secular bear Market in bonds, which means interest rates go up all the financialization of the past 40 years and all those derivative contracts blow up they blow up badly like we saw in 2008 when there was a giant credit trees and nobody would like to anybody Banks wouldn't learn to another Banks.
Overnight rate want to like eight nine ten percent between Banks because they didn't trust each other and you have a complete credit freeze. Now magnify that X multiply that times a hundred is what we're talking about if CEOs and wealthy people around the world pile into Bitcoin and kissed central banks could
buy like goodbye. Yeah. Wow. Okay Max that's that's this has been a really really fascinating conversation has been
so good to have you on the podcast if people want to find out more about what you're doing and your thoughts Etc. What's the best place for them to check you out and follow you?
Well, we have our YouTube channels orange pill.
Definitely subscribe to the YouTube channel orange pill. We got a telegram Group, which is T dot m e /o orange pill. We got a daily newsletter the orange pill daily dose. You can sign up for it orange pill daily dose.com, it's me saying interesting things right in your mailbox everyday. I mean what what could be more could you want look, right?
Awesome Max Keiser. Thank you so much for coming on the real talk with zubi show. It's been a pleasure talking to you.
All right to be any time.
I am the man sick with the Flames taking of destined for fame.
